We're doing out best to try to stay present now that things are winding down after Christmas. At least this year we didn't hear any bombshell news on the holiday. Every year seems to be pretty much the same. A visit from his kids and then limited communication, getting together until Father's day. They share very little about what's going on in their lives with him even when you makes calls to catch up with them. He doesn't seem to feel they have reason to not share with him. He's supportive but offers words of caution from time to time but doesn't harp or follow up with them and nag. They seem loving and respectful of us both when visiting but there's a definite disconnect with the two younger ones. He admits they're closer to his ex than his eldest. We've tried invitations as a couple, invitations by him to meet with them alone but the bond between the younger ones and him hasn't increased. The eldest is in therapy and the relationship with us seems to be getting even better with us. But this is the one who has already repeated shown a desire to have him in her life and know him more. Well it is what it is huh.
So today when he expressed his sadness after the youngest visited last night at the likelihood of not seeing her again for some time, I listened and said I was sorry too that it's this way. She lives far away now and does not include a visit with her dad when she comes into town. We can only keep putting our best selves forward, be grateful everyone is doing ok and accept what is for now. The youngest is boy crazy right now for one thing. lol The new bf had some sort of crisis on Christmas so the youngest let us know through texting her sister that she wouldn't be coming to our house Christmas Day. We put that aside with as much acceptance as possible and tried not to show too much disappointment. We tried to be good hosts to everyone. There was much yawning on Christmas at our house from the new son in law. Oh well.. we're "old" and don't allow alcohol in our home and we did our best to try just ignore the whispering in the living room as we gathered plates for dessert from the kitchen.
I think we can be proud of the work we put into the holiday with one another. Recovery made the difference for having a beautiful holiday. We can be grateful that we could bring all our imperfect selves together this year. Hope yours was a good one. Hugs!
Thanks for letting me share with you. TT
SerenityRUS said
Dec 30, 2017
Big hugs and I am so glad at least they showed up. It might have been disappointing from the expectation side of things however at least it was acknowledged .. hopefully everyone will heal and move forward. Recovery is everything in these kinds of relationships, with recovery comes healing. I keep hoping to get there however I find it hard to let it begin with me.
I'm watching my boyfriend deal with the drama and trauma of his X and it offers an interesting look at life from the other side. His X I believe has issues with pills and has for many years with him leaving she could no longer afford her habit and she did nothing with the expectation he was coming back. When that did not happen her rage came in full force. I watch his daughter because he has tried to continue to reach out to her and I have encouraged him to, however the only time she contacts him is when it's about support that he pays religiously and on time or early .. we should all be that fortunate .. lol .. or she needs something. I will give him some credit in regards to he gets pretty direct about how often he hears from her and lets her know it would be nice to hear from you outside of when you want something from me. I also know that she's caught in the dysfunction of her relationship with her mother and even at 30 for lack of a better term is to lazy to do anything different. It is laziness because it's easier to remain the same than change .. change truly takes awareness and courage.
It seems that in 16 months things have gotten better for them all, it came at a cost in terms of because he's doing what he should .. the X is blocked on the phone and the people she was telling awful things to have started to see through a few things. It takes time. It is sad. Apparently my kids have spent more time with his parents than his own kids. I completely understand this is not an alcoholic home .. the X functioned on that level if that makes sense and no one addressed any of it. I think each time it will get better however it is what it is.
Hugs S :)
Jerry F said
Dec 30, 2017
"It is what it is"...that's a principle for me and not just a slogan and I love it. It runs with the principle of acceptance which is the solution to all of my problems. I remember my inner response to that when I first heard it in a meeting...Aaaaaaaaahhhh Loved it. Mahalo Tired have a great new year. ((((hugs))))
Iamhere said
Dec 31, 2017
(((TT))) - sending you and your guy a belated Merry Christmas and well wishes for a Happy New Year. The holiday season is such a hard, hard time for those who have chosen recovery yet still have 'wreckage from the past'. I recall early in AA recovery that people suggested I do 3 things - Trust God, Clean House and Help Others. That's been in my mind each and every day since Day 1 and flies in often as I go about my day.
Just this morning, I showed my parents my 30 Year Coin for AA. My father who is usually a stoic person who has no faith in mental health and believes that alcoholism is a choice almost cried and made a huge deal out of it. I really did not expect anything but this was so far from the norm, it caught me off-guard.
My mother, who is usually emotional about everything said, "That's neat." I am almost chuckling inside at how God constantly keeps me on my toes and shows me his will when I am so certain I know what's coming....Please share with your man that we can only do so much. I have one brother who still doesn't forgive me for my 'wreckage' and doesn't treat me with much respect. It bothered me for a long time and each gathering, I left feeling as if I hadn't done enough. My sponsor set me straight and suggested I need to be true to myself. If I do not take a drink today, I am a miracle and a success. If I don't hurt another with my words/actions, I am a miracle and a success. If I offer and serve another today, same thing.
Those of us directly affected by this disease live with constant shame, guilt, remorse and regret. Just like in Al-Anon, there is no changing the past. We only have today and sobriety/serenity are not choices, they are gifts, resulting from being willing one day at a time to set aside ego and do what the program suggests.
It took me 20 years to keep my head even when my brother and I were in the same room. It took almost as long to walk over, hug him and say hello or good-bye. His rejection of my amends was like a scab on a sore that kept getting picked each time we crossed paths. I had no choice but to accept that's who he is and it's about him and not me. I can't help another forgive - I can only do my journey and walk in my truth. I do instead try to find gratitude in all who have accepted my amends and love me unconditionally even when I am LTP - Less Than Perfect.
My boys only gave about 2.5 hours in 10 days to my parents, their grand-parents who may not make it to the next holiday. I have been letting God have it for the entire visit, yet am so very sad. My boys were closest to my parents, their grand-parents as we all lived in the same town. Yet, I know there is nothing I can do to change this and must be grateful that they did make some time - they are both clean/sober at the moment and it's a miracle - graced by a power greater than all of us.
I am grateful that tomorrow brings a new day and a new year. (((Hugs))) to you both!
tiredtonite said
Dec 31, 2017
Thank you, all of you. It's so great to be able to post here and be understood. I once visited my exah in rehab and found myself sitting in the community kitchen with an actress mother of an actress. There we were just two people. Fame didn't separate us, united sadly by what we had in common.. someone with the disease of alcoholism/addiction. Awhile back.. both gone, the dau due to her addiction, the mom a day later due to her codependence. I was so new to recovery and so disgusted to find myself sitting where I was sitting. And when everyone gathered in the den to watch the dau's well known movie and hear her narrate, I got up from next to her on the couch and walked out. That's when I met her mother in the kitchen. We exchanged a few words...nothing significant. We sat in silence and sadness. It wasn't her first go around by any means with her dau but it was my first experience as a family member in such a place. But to be sitting across from this old time movie star in a small kitchen in silence with only the hum of the refrigerator brought this disease into perspective for me. Nobody gets a free pass concerning this disease no matter how wealthy, how well known. This memory is helping me to not feel terminally unique today.
Today is my b'day. My brother texted me and I've grown tired of a text a few times a year. As tired as I am of bf's kids coming for a meal and gifts once a year. I texted back "Would appreciate a phone call on my birthday." I enjoyed the rest of the day, honestly I did; but of course it sucks that I didn't get that call. I can go in a lot of directions in speculating why but no need. It was just time to ask for what I wanted and felt I deserved even if it wasn't going to happen. Silly me, if I wanted a call I should have texted don't you dare call me today! Oh well.. nothing funny about it really but par for the course... another unavailable family member who gives scraps only.
(((serenityrus))) thanks for your response. I'm sorry you're experiencing this secondhand drama with your bf's ex. Sad that even when we get away from direct involvement, it still touches us somehow. (((jerry))) Thanks. Yep.. It is what it is. Acceptance of what is.. Sad but true. (((iamhere))) Congratulations to you on your sober anniversary. I'm glad your hp saw fit to gift you with such loving responses from your parents. I'm sorry your sons didn't spend more time at their grandparents home. This is such a baffling disease isn't it. Family who were once so close and now pffft whatever, whenever where their loved ones are concerned. I think part of our acceptance process is knowing we've done what we can and letting go of others response to it. I know my own bro has been harboring the same few resentments concerning me for years. He takes them out when convenient and shoots them like poison arrows at me. Thank you for the kind suggestion you offered concerning my recovering abf and his kids. He's told me about a passage in his program book that talks about being remorseful but not needing to grovel to others who won't accept alcoholics in their sobriety. I'm usually the one who become tearful and hand wringing because I'd been so excited about all of us being family with one another. Usually he is comforting me lol.
Well, here's to 2018! I'll be another year older. LOL I don't feel any wiser Thank you guys for sharing the journey and for your loving support. TT
Iamhere said
Jan 1, 2018
Happy belated birthday TT - so grateful you are in my life and part of my journey. Have a lovely first day of this new year - peace and joy for all are my wishes for today!
SerenityRUS said
Jan 1, 2018
TT .. happy birthday!!! I hope you make it your special day. :) You bring a unique perspective to my awareness. The kids and their dad have no relationship and for him it's my fault. Just like your brother the emotional drive by and nothing more texting is non emotional .. non committal form of communication. He's done his holiday duty and that's that. No phone call only a text. My oldest hasn't made it easy on him .. he calls she ignores the call. She's tired. Tired of the half assed attempts .. the 3x a year texting .. the forced your my kid you'll talk to me .. and I have only said at some point you won't have to worry about those. Now I think I understand better as to the why's of her push backs. He won't. It is the complexity of their relationship of rejection for her. She's verbalized that. I spoke to a lovely man yesterday at Starbucks lol .. And we were commiserating about adult children who were not ready to adult. That whole conversion was a total God thing .. anyways .. sometimes time takes time and sometimes there is not enough time in the world to heal someone else's past. They aren't ready. I speak of myself in that regard. For my kid it's a total maturity thing and my boyfriend's kids .. more then oldest than the youngest same deal. That's between them. Want and wish .. two totally different things .. intention and follow through same idea. In an unhealthy home there is a lot of intention and no follow through. Again it is what it is. Hugs s :)
Aline said
Jan 1, 2018
Happy birthday, TT, I wish you a good year!
What rang the bell most in you shares with me is how your brother doesn't call but only sends messages. I have been in your brother's shoes for a long time in this respect. I don't know if this is in any way helpful to you, but during my years of worst isolation/depression I just didn't have it in me, at all, to communicate with most anyone except the very bare minimum that I felt I was capable of. I was incapable of being emotionally there for anyone, including myself. I support your attempt to make your needs/wants known and voiced, and possibly met! This situation just so reminded me of myself (though yours may well be very different, just the impression I got from your share). At my worst time, anyone who expected to get a emotional response from me was going to a hardware store for bread. I'd actually forgotten how bad I used to be, as bad or worse than my ex-abf, actually. But than again, I'm pretty sure I had depression at the time... Thanks for sharing, TT. It's good to remember, where I am now is definitely a miracle to be grateful for.
tiredtonite said
Jan 3, 2018
Thanks ((everyone))) for the happy birthday wishes. I'm a little late in responding to them I know. I've been able with the use of Alanon tools to regain my focus on my own life and let go of my expectations now. Admittedly, some days are easier than others. Self love is my guide thankfully because of this program. Others action or inaction doesn't have to send my everyday life into an upheaval unless I choose to give my power away to it. Yes, I felt disappointment but I've worked through the hurt now by surrendering it and thankfully I'm fully present again for my hp's will for me.
Yep ((iamhere))) peace and joy, great choices for the new year! I wish you the same, ty!
Thanks ((serenityrus))) There is so much in your second share that I can relate to. "commiserating about adult children who were not ready to adult." We've had this conversation at our house. But I can tell you that for us anyway, we have agreed that we are at times guilty of that as well. Recovering abf admits to this type of stunting of maturity due to past alcohol use and myself through dependency on someone else for my happiness. Only through recovery have we availled ourselves to tools that foster self knowledge and taking responsibility. Without them, the alcohol might be removed from his physical body and my physical home but we might continue in our childlike magical thinking about life and lack accountability for our own lives. It can be so difficult to watch the next generation not recovering. The more years we have in the program, the easier I think it becomes to forget how we were when we got here. So thank you for those reminders. Despite the disappointment concerning the behaviors of others towards us, we are continuing to use program tools of detachment and loving support by responding healthfully rather than reacting to drama and catastrophsizing but admittedly my own slips are often due to excessive worry. Sometimes when it's f2f, I just need to take a deep breath and will say something like I'm sorry you're going through that or you may be right. This has been especially useful with his kids because god forbid I misspeak, lol I will quickly get thrown under the bus Bf himself is the scapegoat too. As you know, family members with no recovery easily believe the A is the cause of all their woes. So, we're glad the program helps us to express empathy but also to take the high road, not own what isn't ours, make amends when necessary, just keep our programs in front of us and let go outcomes. ty!
Thank ((Aline)) I'm sorry for the times you felt so isolated and your depression was at it's worst. I'm so glad you're here as a part of our online family of recovery. You make a good point that we never can really know what is going on with another person. This is where I can get caught up and my emotions can spiral out of control. I have to be mindful not to speculate and project the worst. I can do this because of not knowing enough about my bro and his life today. I try to fill in the blanks, worry takes off, catastrophsizing, believing action is required. In reality, I have no information to prove that any action is necessary. This is a major slip in my Alanon program. My progress is that I no longer "do something." I've heard it said in Alanon, "Don't just do something, sit there." Years in Alanon has helped me to recognize that this is false evidence that I myself am creating. I become my own worst enemy when I don't stay present and stick with the facts in the present moment and don't use the topic Alanon topic "waiting." This too shall pass we say and if I connected with my hp and sit back and wait, usually answers come and serenity is restored. ty for sharing, Aline.
-- Edited by tiredtonite on Wednesday 3rd of January 2018 11:33:32 AM
We're doing out best to try to stay present now that things are winding down after Christmas. At least this year we didn't hear any bombshell news on the holiday. Every year seems to be pretty much the same. A visit from his kids and then limited communication, getting together until Father's day. They share very little about what's going on in their lives with him even when you makes calls to catch up with them. He doesn't seem to feel they have reason to not share with him. He's supportive but offers words of caution from time to time but doesn't harp or follow up with them and nag. They seem loving and respectful of us both when visiting but there's a definite disconnect with the two younger ones. He admits they're closer to his ex than his eldest. We've tried invitations as a couple, invitations by him to meet with them alone but the bond between the younger ones and him hasn't increased. The eldest is in therapy and the relationship with us seems to be getting even better with us. But this is the one who has already repeated shown a desire to have him in her life and know him more. Well it is what it is huh.
So today when he expressed his sadness after the youngest visited last night at the likelihood of not seeing her again for some time, I listened and said I was sorry too that it's this way. She lives far away now and does not include a visit with her dad when she comes into town. We can only keep putting our best selves forward, be grateful everyone is doing ok and accept what is for now. The youngest is boy crazy right now for one thing. lol The new bf had some sort of crisis on Christmas so the youngest let us know through texting her sister that she wouldn't be coming to our house Christmas Day. We put that aside with as much acceptance as possible and tried not to show too much disappointment. We tried to be good hosts to everyone. There was much yawning on Christmas at our house from the new son in law. Oh well.. we're "old" and don't allow alcohol in our home and we did our best to try just ignore the whispering in the living room as we gathered plates for dessert from the kitchen.
I think we can be proud of the work we put into the holiday with one another. Recovery made the difference for having a beautiful holiday. We can be grateful that we could bring all our imperfect selves together this year. Hope yours was a good one. Hugs!
Thanks for letting me share with you. TT
I'm watching my boyfriend deal with the drama and trauma of his X and it offers an interesting look at life from the other side. His X I believe has issues with pills and has for many years with him leaving she could no longer afford her habit and she did nothing with the expectation he was coming back. When that did not happen her rage came in full force. I watch his daughter because he has tried to continue to reach out to her and I have encouraged him to, however the only time she contacts him is when it's about support that he pays religiously and on time or early .. we should all be that fortunate .. lol .. or she needs something. I will give him some credit in regards to he gets pretty direct about how often he hears from her and lets her know it would be nice to hear from you outside of when you want something from me. I also know that she's caught in the dysfunction of her relationship with her mother and even at 30 for lack of a better term is to lazy to do anything different. It is laziness because it's easier to remain the same than change .. change truly takes awareness and courage.
It seems that in 16 months things have gotten better for them all, it came at a cost in terms of because he's doing what he should .. the X is blocked on the phone and the people she was telling awful things to have started to see through a few things. It takes time. It is sad. Apparently my kids have spent more time with his parents than his own kids. I completely understand this is not an alcoholic home .. the X functioned on that level if that makes sense and no one addressed any of it. I think each time it will get better however it is what it is.
Hugs S :)
"It is what it is"...that's a principle for me and not just a slogan and I love it. It runs with the principle of acceptance which is the solution to all of my problems. I remember my inner response to that when I first heard it in a meeting...Aaaaaaaaahhhh Loved it. Mahalo Tired have a great new year. ((((hugs))))
Just this morning, I showed my parents my 30 Year Coin for AA. My father who is usually a stoic person who has no faith in mental health and believes that alcoholism is a choice almost cried and made a huge deal out of it. I really did not expect anything but this was so far from the norm, it caught me off-guard.
My mother, who is usually emotional about everything said, "That's neat." I am almost chuckling inside at how God constantly keeps me on my toes and shows me his will when I am so certain I know what's coming....Please share with your man that we can only do so much. I have one brother who still doesn't forgive me for my 'wreckage' and doesn't treat me with much respect. It bothered me for a long time and each gathering, I left feeling as if I hadn't done enough. My sponsor set me straight and suggested I need to be true to myself. If I do not take a drink today, I am a miracle and a success. If I don't hurt another with my words/actions, I am a miracle and a success. If I offer and serve another today, same thing.
Those of us directly affected by this disease live with constant shame, guilt, remorse and regret. Just like in Al-Anon, there is no changing the past. We only have today and sobriety/serenity are not choices, they are gifts, resulting from being willing one day at a time to set aside ego and do what the program suggests.
It took me 20 years to keep my head even when my brother and I were in the same room. It took almost as long to walk over, hug him and say hello or good-bye. His rejection of my amends was like a scab on a sore that kept getting picked each time we crossed paths. I had no choice but to accept that's who he is and it's about him and not me. I can't help another forgive - I can only do my journey and walk in my truth. I do instead try to find gratitude in all who have accepted my amends and love me unconditionally even when I am LTP - Less Than Perfect.
My boys only gave about 2.5 hours in 10 days to my parents, their grand-parents who may not make it to the next holiday. I have been letting God have it for the entire visit, yet am so very sad. My boys were closest to my parents, their grand-parents as we all lived in the same town. Yet, I know there is nothing I can do to change this and must be grateful that they did make some time - they are both clean/sober at the moment and it's a miracle - graced by a power greater than all of us.
I am grateful that tomorrow brings a new day and a new year. (((Hugs))) to you both!
Thank you, all of you. It's so great to be able to post here and be understood. I once visited my exah in rehab and found myself sitting in the community kitchen with an actress mother of an actress. There we were just two people. Fame didn't separate us, united sadly by what we had in common.. someone with the disease of alcoholism/addiction. Awhile back.. both gone, the dau due to her addiction, the mom a day later due to her codependence. I was so new to recovery and so disgusted to find myself sitting where I was sitting. And when everyone gathered in the den to watch the dau's well known movie and hear her narrate, I got up from next to her on the couch and walked out. That's when I met her mother in the kitchen. We exchanged a few words...nothing significant. We sat in silence and sadness. It wasn't her first go around by any means with her dau but it was my first experience as a family member in such a place. But to be sitting across from this old time movie star in a small kitchen in silence with only the hum of the refrigerator brought this disease into perspective for me. Nobody gets a free pass concerning this disease no matter how wealthy, how well known. This memory is helping me to not feel terminally unique today.
Today is my b'day. My brother texted me and I've grown tired of a text a few times a year. As tired as I am of bf's kids coming for a meal and gifts once a year. I texted back "Would appreciate a phone call on my birthday." I enjoyed the rest of the day, honestly I did; but of course it sucks that I didn't get that call. I can go in a lot of directions in speculating why but no need. It was just time to ask for what I wanted and felt I deserved even if it wasn't going to happen. Silly me, if I wanted a call I should have texted don't you dare call me today!
Oh well.. nothing funny about it really but par for the course... another unavailable family member who gives scraps only.
(((serenityrus))) thanks for your response. I'm sorry you're experiencing this secondhand drama with your bf's ex. Sad that even when we get away from direct involvement, it still touches us somehow. (((jerry))) Thanks. Yep.. It is what it is. Acceptance of what is.. Sad but true. (((iamhere))) Congratulations to you on your sober anniversary. I'm glad your hp saw fit to gift you with such loving responses from your parents. I'm sorry your sons didn't spend more time at their grandparents home. This is such a baffling disease isn't it. Family who were once so close and now pffft whatever, whenever where their loved ones are concerned. I think part of our acceptance process is knowing we've done what we can and letting go of others response to it. I know my own bro has been harboring the same few resentments concerning me for years. He takes them out when convenient and shoots them like poison arrows at me. Thank you for the kind suggestion you offered concerning my recovering abf and his kids. He's told me about a passage in his program book that talks about being remorseful but not needing to grovel to others who won't accept alcoholics in their sobriety. I'm usually the one who become tearful and hand wringing because I'd been so excited about all of us being family with one another. Usually he is comforting me lol.
Well, here's to 2018! I'll be another year older. LOL I don't feel any wiser
Thank you guys for sharing the journey and for your loving support. TT
What rang the bell most in you shares with me is how your brother doesn't call but only sends messages. I have been in your brother's shoes for a long time in this respect. I don't know if this is in any way helpful to you, but during my years of worst isolation/depression I just didn't have it in me, at all, to communicate with most anyone except the very bare minimum that I felt I was capable of. I was incapable of being emotionally there for anyone, including myself. I support your attempt to make your needs/wants known and voiced, and possibly met! This situation just so reminded me of myself (though yours may well be very different, just the impression I got from your share). At my worst time, anyone who expected to get a emotional response from me was going to a hardware store for bread. I'd actually forgotten how bad I used to be, as bad or worse than my ex-abf, actually. But than again, I'm pretty sure I had depression at the time... Thanks for sharing, TT. It's good to remember, where I am now is definitely a miracle to be grateful for.
Thanks ((everyone))) for the happy birthday wishes. I'm a little late in responding to them I know. I've been able with the use of Alanon tools to regain my focus on my own life and let go of my expectations now. Admittedly, some days are easier than others. Self love is my guide thankfully because of this program. Others action or inaction doesn't have to send my everyday life into an upheaval unless I choose to give my power away to it. Yes, I felt disappointment but I've worked through the hurt now by surrendering it and thankfully I'm fully present again for my hp's will for me.
Yep ((iamhere))) peace and joy, great choices for the new year! I wish you the same, ty!
Thanks ((serenityrus))) There is so much in your second share that I can relate to. "commiserating about adult children who were not ready to adult." We've had this conversation at our house. But I can tell you that for us anyway, we have agreed that we are at times guilty of that as well. Recovering abf admits to this type of stunting of maturity due to past alcohol use and myself through dependency on someone else for my happiness. Only through recovery have we availled ourselves to tools that foster self knowledge and taking responsibility. Without them, the alcohol might be removed from his physical body and my physical home but we might continue in our childlike magical thinking about life and lack accountability for our own lives. It can be so difficult to watch the next generation not recovering. The more years we have in the program, the easier I think it becomes to forget how we were when we got here. So thank you for those reminders. Despite the disappointment concerning the behaviors of others towards us, we are continuing to use program tools of detachment and loving support by responding healthfully rather than reacting to drama and catastrophsizing but admittedly my own slips are often due to excessive worry. Sometimes when it's f2f, I just need to take a deep breath and will say something like I'm sorry you're going through that or you may be right. This has been especially useful with his kids because god forbid I misspeak, lol I will quickly get thrown under the bus
Bf himself is the scapegoat too. As you know, family members with no recovery easily believe the A is the cause of all their woes. So, we're glad the program helps us to express empathy but also to take the high road, not own what isn't ours, make amends when necessary, just keep our programs in front of us and let go outcomes. ty!
Thank ((Aline)) I'm sorry for the times you felt so isolated and your depression was at it's worst. I'm so glad you're here as a part of our online family of recovery. You make a good point that we never can really know what is going on with another person. This is where I can get caught up and my emotions can spiral out of control. I have to be mindful not to speculate and project the worst. I can do this because of not knowing enough about my bro and his life today. I try to fill in the blanks, worry takes off, catastrophsizing, believing action is required. In reality, I have no information to prove that any action is necessary. This is a major slip in my Alanon program. My progress is that I no longer "do something." I've heard it said in Alanon, "Don't just do something, sit there." Years in Alanon has helped me to recognize that this is false evidence that I myself am creating. I become my own worst enemy when I don't stay present and stick with the facts in the present moment and don't use the topic Alanon topic "waiting." This too shall pass we say and if I connected with my hp and sit back and wait, usually answers come and serenity is restored. ty for sharing, Aline.
-- Edited by tiredtonite on Wednesday 3rd of January 2018 11:33:32 AM