After a holiday get together,some family members told me they will not be over to my house anymore because of my AH and AS.They are just too afraid of everything that could go wrong or happen while over.I respected their decision and honestly,I do understand why they feel that way,this house can be so crazy,chaotic and unpredictable.
It really hurt to be told this but what hurt even more was when AH found out he blamed ME for it,saying people only know what I tell them and told me it's all my fault.Then AS blamed me too.Both of them said they have done nothing wrong.Of course though it's NOT because of what I have told anyone,it's because of their own behaviors.AH also got upset because I am not mad at these people and defended and understood their decision.He doesn't want me getting around them anymore but the way I see it,this is between them and I am not going to push these people out of my life because of him or AS.
I am trying so hard to not take it personally.I feel so hurt and disgusted that I am being blamed.I'm not surprised that they're not owning up to their mistakes or problems,that's just what they do.But I feel the need to debate this with them,make them 'see the light',that all of this is their own doing,but I know that's pointless.
And I don't know how to just let it go.
ESH please...
-- Edited by SoggySlippers on Wednesday 27th of December 2017 06:32:10 PM
Aline said
Dec 27, 2017
Hugs, (((SS))), I'm really sorry you are experiencing this blaming. I still tend to feel some guilt and anger when something like this happens, but recovery is a process, and I at least have mostly learned not to act on my hurt feelings. One good days I can ignore the blaming completely and remove myself from the situation, like hanging up the phone. There's a tool that I used very often when I was beginning to work this program - fake it till you make it. I acted as if I understooe deep inside the other person is sick. Funny thing is, it helped! In time, this new behavior became more natural, and it became easier to say something like "I'm sorry you feel that way" and mean it too. I can totally relate to feeling its personal, I'm still working on this... I'm not a very fast learner, it seems! What helped and helps me is I listen to AA speakers on YouTube now and again again, the certain similarities that reveal themselves in stories of alcoholics make it more real to me to see alcoholism as a disease with certain characteristics. Keep coming back!!!
hotrod said
Dec 27, 2017
Hello SS I am confused as to the reason that the friends decided not to return Was there an incident or did thy simply not like the drinking? In the future I would say ,i understand please call and tell hubby of your decision
SoggySlippers said
Dec 27, 2017
hotrod wrote:
Hello SS I am confused as to the reason that the friends decided not to return Was there an incident or did thy simply not like the drinking? In the future I would say ,i understand please call and tell hubby of your decision
There wasn't an incident,they just did not feel comfortable being around them while they were intoxicated.
I did ask them to talk to AH about it but they chose not to.I debated even telling him about it at all but they were supposed to come over again this week and he kept asking if they were and when I said no he started nagging,wanting to know why.I regret getting involved in this at all and wish I had told him to contact them if he wanted to know and left it up to him to find out.
SerenityRUS said
Dec 27, 2017
Hugs SS .. I'm so sorry this is going on however it sounds like you learned a humbling lesson I keep coming back to in my current situation. Minding my own business and allowing others to mind theirs. I think your last statement says it all .. next time you have experience to draw from to make the changes you can and accept what you can't. Big hugs ..
Iamhere said
Dec 27, 2017
SS - I can relate big time. I have my AH and 2 AS(s)....and yes, I've been told that we are not welcome because of their actions and the reverse - they prefer to not attend due to the discomfort of the disease active in the home. It does hurt and it did hurt. I too shared with my A(s) and learned that did not serve me well as they also blamed me due to their own denial and distorted thinking.
I no longer share what's said to me by one to another at any point for any reason. It can flow from the original person or not but it stops with me. I carry on with my program and my life and if asked why things are changing or have changed, I'll suggest to my A(s) that they reach out and let me know. I have learned in recovery how to avoid being 'the monkey in the middle'. I have even stopped people from sharing with me about others as if they have strong enough feelings, they should be delivered direct and not second-hand.
I view communication as a very difficult process without this disease. There are so many issues that rise up because of broken/ineffective communications. I care more about my own joy and serenity than others now and just don't want to be a part of dysfunctional communications.
As far as feeling blamed, I heard early on that what others think of me is not my business. Even when it's in my face, it's been suggested to me that I try to just let it go and consider the disease affect. I practice this and it is difficult at times, but I know my own truth and can live with it straight up.
Hang in there. Change takes time and you're doing just fine. Keep coming back!
Mattie said
Dec 27, 2017
Addiction will go to almost any lengths to keep itself going. So when it looks like the A (addict/alcoholic) will experience consequences from the addiction, they do everything they can to deny it. That's how you get those crazy denials: "You were standing there with a drink in your hand." "Someone put it there! I didn't want to offend them so I held their drink for them! I didn't want to do it! I'm the victim here!"
Any halfway sane person could predict that when there's heavy drinking, sober healthy people will not want to come over and be around it. It's complete craziness that an alcoholic would claim that the "real" reason is something else.
Your A may well be wondering about whether people are avoiding coming over because of the drinking. He may well be thinking, "Have they caught on? Do I need to hide it more, or deny it more, or accuse other people more? Why are people out to get me? Why do they persecute me and my innocent pleasures?!" So he may well be trying to track down their objections so he can do some more hiding or defecting.
I don't blame them for not wanting to confront him directly (confronting a drunken person is just an exercise in frustration). Probably if he asked them, they'd come up with some excuse. And if you told him, he'd be all offended and angry and claiming that he's being persecuted. Anyway that's my experience.
But you getting out from between these things is a good idea. "You'll have to ask them" is perfectly justified.
And no wonder you feel angry at all this blaming and craziness. It would be weirder if you just thought, "Oh, that's okay, business as usual!" I don't mean that you shouldn't find acceptance, but that recognizing that you're living with crazy behavior is very realistic.
It sounds very hard to live with - I hope you are getting lots of support. And maybe thinking about whether it's something you want to keep living with? Whatever the future holds, I hope you have a meeting and that you take care of yourself.
Maresie said
Dec 28, 2017
The ex A and his mother too blamed me for a whole lot. After I departed a year or so later the now ex A's brother committed suicide. If I had been around I would have been caught up in all that
In general when we are around alcoholics there is chaos. They are pretty good at passing on the blame. The ex A blamed me for EVERYTHING. I have been gone quite a while now so I guess he got a new scapegoat
The bottom line is expectations. Expecting an active alcohol8c to be responsible kind and fair is not i n the books
The taking it personally is all.about expectations. I do not expect certain people to behave appropriately. I adjust my thoughts towards tj am accordingly. There are sometimes when I simply do not feel with them.
Knowing our limits is so key. When we are around alcoholics our limits can go awol.
The holidays are a big chaotic time for alcoholics. That was thge time if highest conflict for me. I had no idea how to deal escalate it. I allowed the ex A to run riot with it. I put all my maturity aside. I had no perspective
Am anon can help you see escalate stop arguing and start havibg some nutiurng in your life. Not arguing seems lik e a l9ss but ut is actually a big big gain when you know the argument is alreafy lost
Maresie
I
Steph79 said
Dec 28, 2017
I had a similar situation this Xmas - ABF woke up drunk Xmas AM, took 4 more shots and passed out. I was supposed to drop daughter at aunt's and come home, go to Xmas w/ABF's family. I was so mad I texted him "I'm not going today" and just drove around myself. I get a call from his mom "ABF's dad is outside your house waiting for you, and ABF's not answering the phone"... So - I had to explain to her. Then I had to call dad, left a voicemail & texted. I had to apologize for me (didn't apologize for ABF tho!). I got home later - ABF throwing a FIT because it's my fault we didn't go! Broke chairs, messed up the house because *I* ruined Xmas. Sadly, this seems common for A's
SoggySlippers said
Dec 28, 2017
Thanks everyone.Just reading all the replies has made me feel so much better about the whole thing.
I did learn a lesson from it.And I will try so hard to not let myself get caught up in any he said/she said crap anymore.I had a choice in this,instead of caving when AH was nagging,wanting to know,I should have just kept my mouth shut.I need more than duct tape though,I think I may need concrete or super glue or something way more durable.Maybe Gorilla glue,apparently it's waterproof and therefore would work even through the tears.
As far as being blamed,today it just seems ridiculous.And I realize when AH and AS can get me to feel guilty and responsible they stand a good chance of me fixing things for them.I actually thought about doing that last night,trying to smooth everything over for everyone involved.Man,they're so clever...
Nope,not gonna do it though.I'm gonna step back from this one.
PosiesandPuppies said
Dec 28, 2017
Good for you, Soggy!!!
Wonderful insight into how your qualifiers manipulate you! Once you know, it is so hard to blindly go back to the same behavior! Great progress!!
I remember when I got the same AHA moment! Keep it up, recovery is looking good on you!
Steph79 said
Dec 28, 2017
Good lesson for me too! Thank you Soggy, and good work - thanks for sharing the lesson. I could use some Gorilla Glue too I think
KhirDan said
Dec 29, 2017
Whoa! This really hit home for me. I'd like to share that you are not alone in being blamed - and it is good for me to know I am not alone either.
My wife is the alcoholic, and I am a recovering enabler/codependent. In an alcoholic rage, she threw me out of the house, and then when sober, begged me to come back. Ever since, she has been laying the blame for this incident at my feet, with subsequent rages. I was not completely innocent in this - buying wine, telling her I didn't think she has a problem drinking.
My promise to myself in recovery (Al-Anon - thank God!) was and is to be completely honest - T.H.I.N.K. - and when I am wrong to admit it, make amends, and ask for forgiveness. Sometimes this helps, sometimes not. Sometimes my Higher Power alone is the only help, and He is always close.
Thanks for letting me share.
-- Edited by KhirDan on Friday 29th of December 2017 04:24:57 PM
2HP said
Dec 30, 2017
when an alcoholic lays blame on everyone else, they don't have to take responsibility. Deny, deny, deny. This allows them to maintain the illusion that everything is okay. And they rely on enablers to keep the illusion going. Anyone NOT enabling them is a threat to their addiction.
You are not crazy, my friend. We have an unofficial slogan that always helped me get clear about blame:
B-L-A-M-E without ME is just BLA BLA BLA
How to just let it go?
I began the practice of LETTING GO AND LETTING GOD with a God Box I kept under my bed. I'd write down everything that I wanted to "hand over" to God on a piece of paper. I'd prayerfully put it in the box and refuse to think about it any more. Seemed silly at first, but powerful
(((peace)))
hotrod said
Dec 30, 2017
((2HP I had forgotten the saying blame without "ME" is just' bla lba bla" -- thanks
After a holiday get together,some family members told me they will not be over to my house anymore because of my AH and AS.They are just too afraid of everything that could go wrong or happen while over.I respected their decision and honestly,I do understand why they feel that way,this house can be so crazy,chaotic and unpredictable.
It really hurt to be told this but what hurt even more was when AH found out he blamed ME for it,saying people only know what I tell them and told me it's all my fault.Then AS blamed me too.Both of them said they have done nothing wrong.Of course though it's NOT because of what I have told anyone,it's because of their own behaviors.AH also got upset because I am not mad at these people and defended and understood their decision.He doesn't want me getting around them anymore but the way I see it,this is between them and I am not going to push these people out of my life because of him or AS.
I am trying so hard to not take it personally.I feel so hurt and disgusted that I am being blamed.I'm not surprised that they're not owning up to their mistakes or problems,that's just what they do.But I feel the need to debate this with them,make them 'see the light',that all of this is their own doing,but I know that's pointless.
And I don't know how to just let it go.
ESH please...
-- Edited by SoggySlippers on Wednesday 27th of December 2017 06:32:10 PM
There wasn't an incident,they just did not feel comfortable being around them while they were intoxicated.
I did ask them to talk to AH about it but they chose not to.I debated even telling him about it at all but they were supposed to come over again this week and he kept asking if they were and when I said no he started nagging,wanting to know why.I regret getting involved in this at all and wish I had told him to contact them if he wanted to know and left it up to him to find out.
I no longer share what's said to me by one to another at any point for any reason. It can flow from the original person or not but it stops with me. I carry on with my program and my life and if asked why things are changing or have changed, I'll suggest to my A(s) that they reach out and let me know. I have learned in recovery how to avoid being 'the monkey in the middle'. I have even stopped people from sharing with me about others as if they have strong enough feelings, they should be delivered direct and not second-hand.
I view communication as a very difficult process without this disease. There are so many issues that rise up because of broken/ineffective communications. I care more about my own joy and serenity than others now and just don't want to be a part of dysfunctional communications.
As far as feeling blamed, I heard early on that what others think of me is not my business. Even when it's in my face, it's been suggested to me that I try to just let it go and consider the disease affect. I practice this and it is difficult at times, but I know my own truth and can live with it straight up.
Hang in there. Change takes time and you're doing just fine. Keep coming back!
Addiction will go to almost any lengths to keep itself going. So when it looks like the A (addict/alcoholic) will experience consequences from the addiction, they do everything they can to deny it. That's how you get those crazy denials: "You were standing there with a drink in your hand." "Someone put it there! I didn't want to offend them so I held their drink for them! I didn't want to do it! I'm the victim here!"
Any halfway sane person could predict that when there's heavy drinking, sober healthy people will not want to come over and be around it. It's complete craziness that an alcoholic would claim that the "real" reason is something else.
Your A may well be wondering about whether people are avoiding coming over because of the drinking. He may well be thinking, "Have they caught on? Do I need to hide it more, or deny it more, or accuse other people more? Why are people out to get me? Why do they persecute me and my innocent pleasures?!" So he may well be trying to track down their objections so he can do some more hiding or defecting.
I don't blame them for not wanting to confront him directly (confronting a drunken person is just an exercise in frustration). Probably if he asked them, they'd come up with some excuse. And if you told him, he'd be all offended and angry and claiming that he's being persecuted. Anyway that's my experience.
But you getting out from between these things is a good idea. "You'll have to ask them" is perfectly justified.
And no wonder you feel angry at all this blaming and craziness. It would be weirder if you just thought, "Oh, that's okay, business as usual!" I don't mean that you shouldn't find acceptance, but that recognizing that you're living with crazy behavior is very realistic.
It sounds very hard to live with - I hope you are getting lots of support. And maybe thinking about whether it's something you want to keep living with? Whatever the future holds, I hope you have a meeting and that you take care of yourself.
The ex A and his mother too blamed me for a whole lot. After I departed a year or so later the now ex A's brother committed suicide. If I had been around I would have been caught up in all that
In general when we are around alcoholics there is chaos. They are pretty good at passing on the blame. The ex A blamed me for EVERYTHING. I have been gone quite a while now so I guess he got a new scapegoat
The bottom line is expectations. Expecting an active alcohol8c to be responsible kind and fair is not i n the books
The taking it personally is all.about expectations. I do not expect certain people to behave appropriately. I adjust my thoughts towards tj am accordingly. There are sometimes when I simply do not feel with them.
Knowing our limits is so key. When we are around alcoholics our limits can go awol.
The holidays are a big chaotic time for alcoholics. That was thge time if highest conflict for me. I had no idea how to deal escalate it. I allowed the ex A to run riot with it. I put all my maturity aside. I had no perspective
Am anon can help you see escalate stop arguing and start havibg some nutiurng in your life. Not arguing seems lik e a l9ss but ut is actually a big big gain when you know the argument is alreafy lost
Maresie
I
Thanks everyone.Just reading all the replies has made me feel so much better about the whole thing.
I did learn a lesson from it.And I will try so hard to not let myself get caught up in any he said/she said crap anymore.I had a choice in this,instead of caving when AH was nagging,wanting to know,I should have just kept my mouth shut.I need more than duct tape though,I think I may need concrete or super glue or something way more durable.Maybe Gorilla glue,apparently it's waterproof and therefore would work even through the tears.
As far as being blamed,today it just seems ridiculous.And I realize when AH and AS can get me to feel guilty and responsible they stand a good chance of me fixing things for them.I actually thought about doing that last night,trying to smooth everything over for everyone involved.Man,they're so clever...
Nope,not gonna do it though.I'm gonna step back from this one.
Wonderful insight into how your qualifiers manipulate you! Once you know, it is so hard to blindly go back to the same behavior! Great progress!!
I remember when I got the same AHA moment! Keep it up, recovery is looking good on you!
Whoa! This really hit home for me. I'd like to share that you are not alone in being blamed - and it is good for me to know I am not alone either.
My wife is the alcoholic, and I am a recovering enabler/codependent. In an alcoholic rage, she threw me out of the house, and then when sober, begged me to come back. Ever since, she has been laying the blame for this incident at my feet, with subsequent rages. I was not completely innocent in this - buying wine, telling her I didn't think she has a problem drinking.
My promise to myself in recovery (Al-Anon - thank God!) was and is to be completely honest - T.H.I.N.K. - and when I am wrong to admit it, make amends, and ask for forgiveness. Sometimes this helps, sometimes not. Sometimes my Higher Power alone is the only help, and He is always close.
Thanks for letting me share.
-- Edited by KhirDan on Friday 29th of December 2017 04:24:57 PM
You are not crazy, my friend. We have an unofficial slogan that always helped me get clear about blame:
B-L-A-M-E without ME is just BLA BLA BLA
How to just let it go?
I began the practice of LETTING GO AND LETTING GOD with a God Box I kept under my bed. I'd write down everything that I wanted to "hand over" to God on a piece of paper. I'd prayerfully put it in the box and refuse to think about it any more. Seemed silly at first, but powerful
(((peace)))
LOVE THAT!