At times I feel like AH's recovery is just as difficult as when he was drinking.
It's been just over a month since he has come back into the house. For the most part it has been good....as in there has been only 1 time that I have questioned his actions as to possibly have had a few drinks.
We went away for two days just him and I. I was so excited, yes had high expectations of what the time away would be like. We used to enjoy the quick get aways, but of course he was drinking. This time was a first. The laughs were few and the affection was nil!
I had asked him if everything was okay, he said he needs to work on himself. I asked if there was anything he needed from me, no he said. I asked him about the lack off affection. And again he said he needed to work on him on him before there can be any kind of affection.
We used to be very very affectionate. So much so it would drive my kids crazy with "public displays of affection" holding hands, stealing kisses, a$$ grabs, it has always been like that. Even before his drinking really took control. When it did, yes there was affection, but it was different. Now here I sit, a month into this new life.....and there is 0. I don't count me giving me a good night kiss before I crawl into bed alone (he sleeps on the couch) as affection. It's more of a habit.
I was completely heart broken when he said he has to work on himself, before any affection can happen!! I don't even mean sex! Because for me it's not quanity of its quality of it. We had times due to work that it would be weeks without (but the quality made it worth the wait). I mean the affection we had for each. There has been 0 hugs, 0 everything that even hints at a glimmer of attraction.
Now I wrestle with myself!! I can have empathy for AH knowing he is struggling with his own issues, I can give him space, and be present in the room, should he want to have some casual conversation, or I can sit quiet.
My needs are real too! Why do I need the affection?? It hurts like hell to feel unwanted! Is he seeing me through sober eyes and realizing it isn't me he wanted??? It also makes me question, if and when we are in a public setting around people who have seen us together before with our "PDA", and he puts on a show will it be sincere? Will it ever be sincere? I worry about the kids too (mainly my youngest....far too smart for her own good) Who seen us so loving, he when he was "sick".
I know this is just proof I need to work on me, to love me first. Right now I'm having my own pitty party and feeling unlovable.
Thanks for letting me share a rough moment.
hotrod said
Dec 6, 2017
((Curlyblu)) i agree sobriety can be a difficult road however i would take it over the drinking years hands down. I know the first few years of my husband's sobriety were a challenge as we were both learning new life lessons he in AA an myself in Alanon. I believe ti took me about 3 years of sobriety to regain my affection, ability to trust and ability to engage in an intimate manner.
You are not alone. Recovery is a process.
Iamhere said
Dec 6, 2017
(((Curlyblu))) - Speaking from my own experience, I had never been intimate with another person sober and it scared me greatly when I got sober. Everything that I had ever done was 'assisted' by a mind altering substance for a long, long while and everything I had to do sober was overwhelming.
As far as my Al-Anon experience, I believe it's been helpful for me to have had the other first. I know that beginning sobriety is very hard and very scary. I know that sobriety has to be the number one priority and nobody/nothing should be placed above it. I'm grateful that recovery kept reminding me that my wants/will are secondary to those of my HP and recovery made me learn patience and tolerance for others.
Gratitude lists really really helped me focus on what was better and working vs. what was broken still or not working. Keep coming back! You are not alone!
2HP said
Dec 6, 2017
Great honest share and I love that you are aware of the solution.
Like you, I had a dis-ease of perspective and understand very well all the feelings that go along with errors in my thinking... I would just go along with everything that popped into my head, believing my every thought.
My hope is that you stop taking this perceived "rejection" personally because it is NOT personal, sweetie. I was told this "feeling" kinda shows me what I have to work on - at getting better with "Letting Go," rather than getting better at feeling rejected (which is a painful thought)
It also helps me to consider that everyone on the planet is dealing with their "stuff"... (again, nothing personal) All of us on a personal journey and for me, it's no small potatoes either... some days, I need my partners understanding and I am so grateful he is loaded with patience.
(((big hugs)))
SerenityRUS said
Dec 6, 2017
Big hugs,
Here in support. I think the biggest lesson I have learned is (emotional not just physical) sobriety is not recovery and the recovery part of the deal is incredibly scary because it means more than one emotion, not being sure about emotions and how to be vulnerable. I'm just talking from my standpoint I can't imagine the other side of the equation. I would think it would be even more terrifying in a lot of ways.
You are right you have needs and you have the right to state what they are, work on yourself and continue to do the best you can. Going to treatment doesn't mean it fixes everything usually going to treatment is the beginning of the journey for all involved .. just my opinion and observation.
Hugs S :)
Curlyblu said
Dec 6, 2017
((Betty))
I most certainly would never choose living with an active A over this confusion.
((Iamhere))
I remember those days as well, when I too could not be intimate with anyone unless I was altered. AH was the first man to ever break that cycle for me, and I learnt what being really intimate with someone ment.
This is also where I need to improve on my own journey. His recovery has to be his top priority, and needs to come first. This road is most definately a difficult one.
((2HP))
Rejection is an ugly feeling. And clearly something I need to learn to let go of. Not taking anything personally is huge for me. "Was that comment directed at me? What was that supposed to mean? Why is she/he looking at me like that? What will think if I wear/do that?"
I'm seeing more and more today, where I need to go with this recovery......it's not just about the letting go the hurts of living with an A........but letting go of clearly far more than I realized.
Thank you all for your shares, it has helped look a little deeper inside (that's scary in itself)
-- Edited by Curlyblu on Wednesday 6th of December 2017 02:19:16 PM
Curlyblu said
Dec 6, 2017
((Thanks Serenity))
When AH decided to get sober, I had rose colour glasses on! Whoo woo, I'm getting him back finally! Soooo not the case! His recovery is clearly a long hard road. I wasn't expecting him to turn so inward. Close up.
I know it's none of my bussiness what his issues are they are for him to deal with and make right in his own way and time. Yes I thought the journey was something we would travel together. (those dang glasses again)
I know I know....I need to pull my head of .......and make myself right!
Again thank you for your shares and support
((hugs all))
SerenityRUS said
Dec 7, 2017
Again with the personal observation .. sometimes communication starting slow isn't a bad thing .. he's not the same .. neither are you. My relationship with the ex is always based around crisis .. legal/ financial/ and so on .. it was directly or indirectly around drinking or not drinking. It was Damaging to the point that as a person .. i don't Find many redeeming qualities about him. Even in non addiction based relationships laughter and fun is key .. you have to laugh with your partner .. that's my opinion because life is hard .. that's reality .. living is a painful process which is why I have to focus on the good. Pain is a given .. death is a give .. living in the moment is that immediate moment is a huge gift. Finding fun and connecting in ways that aren't sexual however lead to that type of intimacy is huge in a relationship. How does that happen without the altered state? I don't have answers for that except to go slow and be silly together .. be tender .. this is a discovery moment not a pressure moment. Be patient with yourself .. Again you do have a right to be heard .. I don't know many people who want a sexless relationship. If it's not there it's not there. For some that is enough and that's ok for them. So let time take time communicate without expectation don't take it personally and keep healing. Big hugs.
2HP said
Dec 7, 2017
Having a personal definition of "recovery" is very helpful....
Answering why I'm in recovery....... and what it is in ME I need to recover from....... all was very helpful for ME to know.......on a spiritual journey.
And by keeping my focus on that definition, I can always ask myself if what I'm thinking is even true? lol
Is it true I need to rely on OTHERS, is that the message of Al-Anon?
Honestly watching my thoughts and perspectives keeps me from "needing" so much from others. When I'm needing from others and not getting it, my life begins feeling unmanageable and the sticking point in ME becomes clear. What do I really need from others close to me? a peaceful environment... (a tornado in the house did not provide a nurturing environment to meet my goal.) Having some peace and quiet, I can thrive in my reading and writing, meditating, playing piano, painting, cooking and baking... to thrive spiritually, that is my ultimate ambition today.
Beyond that, keeping LOW EXPECTATIONS of others, frees me from attachment.
Anyway, just chiming in again to let you know that your "willingness" is a joy to observe, because that is ultimately what is going to "save" you. nothing or no one else (((hugs)))
-- Edited by 2HP on Thursday 7th of December 2017 11:23:15 AM
-- Edited by 2HP on Thursday 7th of December 2017 11:28:21 AM
Jerry F said
Dec 7, 2017
This is a great post and for me listening to the "ladies of Al-Anon" when I first arrived was crazy making and then after learning that I also had a female side with feelings and thoughts and wants and needs and issues I shrunk the relationship down to two differences only...age and gender and started to and still do grow from it.
Yes of course anything new especially new behaviors are difficult and often insane and then when I was able to also see the outcomes in others and the consequences in their lives I learned to say, think and believe "I want that too". Part of the consequences was that my recovery, my changes, gave my parents and family the member they actually appreciated without knowing how it came about.
My sponsor suggested to me, "You are going to have to separate yourself from all things alcohol"...and I did which included my family or origin, my wife and relationships. No regrets at all. (((hugs))) Keep coming back.
-- Edited by Jerry F on Thursday 7th of December 2017 12:26:16 PM
-- Edited by Jerry F on Thursday 7th of December 2017 12:26:59 PM
MizzB said
Dec 7, 2017
Hi CurlyBlu,
I am exactly there with you on the lack of affection and intimacy. Mine has been going on months now. I'm running out of patience. I know his recovery is important but I have needs too. It's hard. i completely understand feeling unlovable, unattractive. It's really hard. I no answers, only shared understanding.
At times I feel like AH's recovery is just as difficult as when he was drinking.
It's been just over a month since he has come back into the house. For the most part it has been good....as in there has been only 1 time that I have questioned his actions as to possibly have had a few drinks.
We went away for two days just him and I. I was so excited, yes had high expectations of what the time away would be like. We used to enjoy the quick get aways, but of course he was drinking. This time was a first. The laughs were few and the affection was nil!
I had asked him if everything was okay, he said he needs to work on himself. I asked if there was anything he needed from me, no he said. I asked him about the lack off affection. And again he said he needed to work on him on him before there can be any kind of affection.
We used to be very very affectionate. So much so it would drive my kids crazy with "public displays of affection" holding hands, stealing kisses, a$$ grabs, it has always been like that. Even before his drinking really took control. When it did, yes there was affection, but it was different. Now here I sit, a month into this new life.....and there is 0. I don't count me giving me a good night kiss before I crawl into bed alone (he sleeps on the couch) as affection. It's more of a habit.
I was completely heart broken when he said he has to work on himself, before any affection can happen!! I don't even mean sex! Because for me it's not quanity of its quality of it. We had times due to work that it would be weeks without (but the quality made it worth the wait). I mean the affection we had for each. There has been 0 hugs, 0 everything that even hints at a glimmer of attraction.
Now I wrestle with myself!! I can have empathy for AH knowing he is struggling with his own issues, I can give him space, and be present in the room, should he want to have some casual conversation, or I can sit quiet.
My needs are real too! Why do I need the affection?? It hurts like hell to feel unwanted! Is he seeing me through sober eyes and realizing it isn't me he wanted??? It also makes me question, if and when we are in a public setting around people who have seen us together before with our "PDA", and he puts on a show will it be sincere? Will it ever be sincere? I worry about the kids too (mainly my youngest....far too smart for her own good) Who seen us so loving, he when he was "sick".
I know this is just proof I need to work on me, to love me first. Right now I'm having my own pitty party and feeling unlovable.
Thanks for letting me share a rough moment.
You are not alone. Recovery is a process.
As far as my Al-Anon experience, I believe it's been helpful for me to have had the other first. I know that beginning sobriety is very hard and very scary. I know that sobriety has to be the number one priority and nobody/nothing should be placed above it. I'm grateful that recovery kept reminding me that my wants/will are secondary to those of my HP and recovery made me learn patience and tolerance for others.
Gratitude lists really really helped me focus on what was better and working vs. what was broken still or not working. Keep coming back! You are not alone!
Great honest share and I love that you are aware of the solution.
Like you, I had a dis-ease of perspective and understand very well all the feelings that go along with errors in my thinking... I would just go along with everything that popped into my head, believing my every thought.
My hope is that you stop taking this perceived "rejection" personally because it is NOT personal, sweetie. I was told this "feeling" kinda shows me what I have to work on - at getting better with "Letting Go," rather than getting better at feeling rejected (which is a painful thought)
It also helps me to consider that everyone on the planet is dealing with their "stuff"... (again, nothing personal) All of us on a personal journey and for me, it's no small potatoes either... some days, I need my partners understanding and I am so grateful he is loaded with patience.
(((big hugs)))
Here in support. I think the biggest lesson I have learned is (emotional not just physical) sobriety is not recovery and the recovery part of the deal is incredibly scary because it means more than one emotion, not being sure about emotions and how to be vulnerable. I'm just talking from my standpoint I can't imagine the other side of the equation. I would think it would be even more terrifying in a lot of ways.
You are right you have needs and you have the right to state what they are, work on yourself and continue to do the best you can. Going to treatment doesn't mean it fixes everything usually going to treatment is the beginning of the journey for all involved .. just my opinion and observation.
Hugs S :)
((Betty))
I most certainly would never choose living with an active A over this confusion.
((Iamhere))
I remember those days as well, when I too could not be intimate with anyone unless I was altered. AH was the first man to ever break that cycle for me, and I learnt what being really intimate with someone ment.
This is also where I need to improve on my own journey. His recovery has to be his top priority, and needs to come first. This road is most definately a difficult one.
((2HP))
Rejection is an ugly feeling. And clearly something I need to learn to let go of. Not taking anything personally is huge for me. "Was that comment directed at me? What was that supposed to mean? Why is she/he looking at me like that? What will think if I wear/do that?"
I'm seeing more and more today, where I need to go with this recovery......it's not just about the letting go the hurts of living with an A........but letting go of clearly far more than I realized.
Thank you all for your shares, it has helped look a little deeper inside (that's scary in itself)
-- Edited by Curlyblu on Wednesday 6th of December 2017 02:19:16 PM
((Thanks Serenity))
When AH decided to get sober, I had rose colour glasses on! Whoo woo, I'm getting him back finally! Soooo not the case! His recovery is clearly a long hard road. I wasn't expecting him to turn so inward. Close up.
I know it's none of my bussiness what his issues are they are for him to deal with and make right in his own way and time. Yes I thought the journey was something we would travel together. (those dang glasses again)
I know I know....I need to pull my head of .......and make myself right!
Again thank you for your shares and support
((hugs all))
Having a personal definition of "recovery" is very helpful....
Answering why I'm in recovery....... and what it is in ME I need to recover from....... all was very helpful for ME to know.......on a spiritual journey.
And by keeping my focus on that definition, I can always ask myself if what I'm thinking is even true? lol
Is it true I need to rely on OTHERS, is that the message of Al-Anon?
Honestly watching my thoughts and perspectives keeps me from "needing" so much from others. When I'm needing from others and not getting it, my life begins feeling unmanageable and the sticking point in ME becomes clear. What do I really need from others close to me? a peaceful environment... (a tornado in the house did not provide a nurturing environment to meet my goal.) Having some peace and quiet, I can thrive in my reading and writing, meditating, playing piano, painting, cooking and baking... to thrive spiritually, that is my ultimate ambition today.
Beyond that, keeping LOW EXPECTATIONS of others, frees me from attachment.
Anyway, just chiming in again to let you know that your "willingness" is a joy to observe, because that is ultimately what is going to "save" you. nothing or no one else (((hugs)))
-- Edited by 2HP on Thursday 7th of December 2017 11:23:15 AM
-- Edited by 2HP on Thursday 7th of December 2017 11:28:21 AM
This is a great post and for me listening to the "ladies of Al-Anon" when I first arrived was crazy making and then after learning that I also had a female side with feelings and thoughts and wants and needs and issues I shrunk the relationship down to two differences only...age and gender and started to and still do grow from it.
Yes of course anything new especially new behaviors are difficult and often insane and then when I was able to also see the outcomes in others and the consequences in their lives I learned to say, think and believe "I want that too". Part of the consequences was that my recovery, my changes, gave my parents and family the member they actually appreciated without knowing how it came about.
My sponsor suggested to me, "You are going to have to separate yourself from all things alcohol"...and I did which included my family or origin, my wife and relationships. No regrets at all. (((hugs))) Keep coming back.
-- Edited by Jerry F on Thursday 7th of December 2017 12:26:16 PM
-- Edited by Jerry F on Thursday 7th of December 2017 12:26:59 PM
I am exactly there with you on the lack of affection and intimacy. Mine has been going on months now. I'm running out of patience. I know his recovery is important but I have needs too. It's hard. i completely understand feeling unlovable, unattractive. It's really hard. I no answers, only shared understanding.