So the headliner says it all. 29 years. I have been physically separated from my AH for a little over a month... emotionally, perhaps a year.
Last night I had a crying jag. First time I have cried since proclaiming to my AH that it was "Him or me, but someone was leaving the house," in August. It was weird. I know part of this was b/c I was bone tired (I was at my son's band field competition all day -uniform manager).
I had the "pleasure" of many texts and calls from my AH... even one from his sister asking how many times my AH has gone to an event of our sons. I told her not since sophomore year (he is now a senior). Then she tells me, "I thought so, I think that he just wants his car keys back." I finally had to mute both of them b/c I had so much to handle at the time. His last text was please call me.
Once home and showered, I took the time to call him. From the way the phone was "answered," I could tell he was plastered. Sigh. I never said a word. He never really was able to get any coherent words, and finally hung up the phone, only to call back later. The conversation was just a sob-fest from him. A whole lot of "I'm sorry I have done this to you guys." It was gut-wrenching to hear, quite frankly. But I stuck to telling him how his son did/the band did at the competition, and a lot of "I knows." I didn't really know what else to say. I hung up after telling him I will tell his son that he was glad today went well and that he loves him.
That is when the emotions came. I cried on and off for an hour. Cried for his pathetic, current situation, cried over the fact that Sunday will be 29 years, cried over my current situation. I let it all out. Then went to sleep.
Today, I am emotionally low. I am thinking about the anniversary, the legal separation papers I am filing, and the fact that I have gone from panic mode/super emotional state (at time of move-out) to one that is kind of numb.
My AH said something last night to me that has stuck with me... while sobbing to me, he said, "I am sorry, it's just that this (meaning he and I) is all I know!" It made me sad to think that my reality is that I've felt - for all intents and purposes - "single" for a long time, and being a couple is NOT all I know.
Thanks for listening.
mamakat71 said
Oct 15, 2017
Hello,
I am so sorry for your struggle. I am facing a similar situation. I was married for 20 years to my first ah. He passed away 8 years ago leaving me and 5 kids behind. I didn't know about the help of alanon and didn't get proper counseling and here I am remarried to ah #2. I am considering separation as well. My current ah is not ready for help and is lying and sneaking around drinking. I came here because of a crisis that could have resulted in harm to my youngest son involving my ah. My ah has not said he is sorry or taken any responsibility for any of it or any other mean thing spoken or done since we have been married. I know that is the disease but it still hurts. I am still new to all of the help that is available here and thought I would wait longer to make the decision to separate, I am still not 100% sure about doing anything. All of the emotions that you are experiencing are real and I have them too. I hope that things become clearer for both of us over time and that we can truly heal and move forward to a better place.
Hugs to you!
PosiesandPuppies said
Oct 15, 2017
Welcome, Mamakat!
I am sorry you are going through this struggle again. Stick around... I found some peace here, and I feel you might too!
(((Mamakat)))
Iamhere said
Oct 16, 2017
(((PnP))) - huge hugs girl - I am sending you tons of positive thoughts and prayers. If I 'read' your share over, it seems to me you are grieving and that to me appears to be very normal. It took me a long time to find the balance between my head (taking action for me) and my heart (letting go of unhealthy people, places and things). I so remember that numb feeling and as with others, it too shall pass.
Be gentle and good to you. You are doing great and you are not alone!
Maresie25 said
Oct 16, 2017
It sounds like his family is on to his manipulations pretty well. That is an incredible achievement.
I could, of course, also make that excuse of this is all I know, much of my life about the situations I found myself in.
At some point i got willing to know something else.
I admire your resolve to make your son's life as normal as possible when you feel so bad. That is an incredible strength.
I know alcoholic's who claim their children are estranged from them. They don't even bother to look at their children's Facebook pages.
I also know alcoholic's who have their children on the weekend. That weekend consists of the child watching the parent drink themselves silly.
Alcoholics can be very very good at getting what they need from others. The alcoholic woman (who is a neighbor) cries all the time she only has her son on the weekend.
He spends his whole time mooching around while she drinks herself to sleep. She puts a considerable effort into appearing "wronged" but really the wrong is in that she refuses to address her alcoholism.
I bought all the manipulations, the constant phone calls, the pleas before. Now I am able to detach from them. I have to say that often I felt the 'sorrow" that the alcoholic could not feel.
These days I feel like I have enough to deal with. I feel sad and very sorry for an alcoholic who does nothing to recover. I no longer believe it is my mission to do something about it.
My whole self worth is not tied up in that.
Boundaries are so important. You are teaching your son so much by having them. What an incredible gift that is.
i look forward to a live with better boundaries and a better ability to be compassionate and kind without taking on the emotions that someone else needs to feel for themselves.
Maresie.
YARNCRAZY said
Oct 16, 2017
I LEFT AFTER 25 YRS AND ITS LIKE A DEATH. YOU WILL EXPERIENCE CRYING,ANGER,REGRET,BASICALLY EVERY EMOTION. TODAY 2YRS LATER, IM PROUD OF MYSELF,AM IN A NEW RELATIONSHIP AND CAREFULLY USING ALANON TO KEEP ME ON TRACK. WISHING YOU COMFORT AND PEACE AS YOU HEAL.
PosiesandPuppies said
Oct 16, 2017
Thank you, Iamhere for your kind words.
Thank you, Maresie for your insight, and YarnCrazy for your healing thoughts.
It was a tough day... and my AH had the audacity to text me "Happy Anniversary!" Of course I didn't see it until this morning b/c I had blocked him all day yesterday.
Sigh.
KT2015 said
Oct 17, 2017
Hi PnP
Thanks for your honest share. I can relate to how you feel. I have felt "single" myself for a while too. His drinking cycles and so does my ability to have a stable relationship with him. I find I get too attached when things go well and then have to detach when things aren't good. I've been working on that but the process can be quite lonely. I find my AH will have a tiny bit of insight into the problems and trying to fix things and then eventually falls right back into denial. Denial that things in our relationship aren't so great. That we have had any problems in the past. I see this huge discrepancy between what he wants and what the disease wants. He wants our marriage to work but his disease keeps causing problems in our marriage. He can't reconcile these two things and it is very hard to watch someone I love and who I know loves me get taken over by a disease. I went through that grief process recently in a different way. We are still together at the moment but I recently had to accept that my AH and I are never going to be the way we were. Our old life together is gone. I held on for quite a while hoping that if he would just get some help then we could go back to our old relationship. That's not going to happen. I think that if I end up leaving my AH will go through that grief process at that moment too. Even though I feel like I've told him over and over that his drinking is effecting our marriage he won' t see it until it's over. The disease is cunning in that way. It keeps the individual locked in denial so they can keep drinking. I hope that you are doing ok and being gentle with yourself giving yourself time to move through this difficult date. Sending you hugs and strength.
SerenityRUS said
Oct 17, 2017
Big hugs,
I find that my grief came in waves .. I can remember standing in the grocery store line and tears .. I wasn't sobbing just tears were coming down my face and the poor little checkout gal asked me if I was ok and honestly I totally was .. I just hadn't cried for such a LONG time that I didn't know how to process everything.
The longer things went by the swells in emotions ebbed .. it's all good it's part of healing and it IS sad. There is nothing happy about the breakdown of a relationship especially one so long.
Ironically is Oct 15th is the anniversary of my divorce. LOL .. I joke my pseudo divorce since I had to get redivorced in January of the immediate year after. UGH.
Anyway .. it will pass and hopefully you can both move in whatever direction your HP has planned and I think it's more important your AH get help and you continue to heal.
Hugs S :)
PosiesandPuppies said
Oct 17, 2017
KT - I completely understand your share... my AH seems to acknowledge our separation in one moment, and then the next acts like it's just temporary.
Serenity - So good to see your face!! I have missed your posts here. You are right, there is nothing happy about the breakdown of a relationship. Lately, though, I have been feeling oddly disconnected... kind of numb. It is making it hard to make concrete decisions when it comes to my AH and my next steps. Hope your daughter is doing well in college!
mamalioness said
Oct 17, 2017
((((((((((((((((((((((PnP)))))))))))))))))))))) 29 years is a long time investment...Of course your gonna cry and miss what could have been, what SHOULD have been...like stability, equality, respect, mutual "flying in the same direction" hanging out and having fun, romance...All of it....I cried when I made my AH #2 leave....what could have been, hit me like a truck when I shipped his stuff to the apt. by the base that he had rented......yea, for me it was 13 married, 17 years all together.......all gone!!! Poof!!!! but it was for the best...I knew then...I know now....doesn't mean I don't miss the fun times we had together.....I don't miss the drunken talking to the tv, yelling at the dogs (he never physically abused them) but he mostly would "complain" to them...don't miss the burned up pots and pans and the sound of him "hurling" his innards from too much Jack and Coke...Beer he wasn't so bad..Wine either., but that hard stuff??? OMG....it was awful....I don't miss the worrying when he was wasted and driving the truck.....I don't miss watching him on a daily basis, toss poison down this throat towards a slow and painful death.....I still think of him, hope is is OK, etc., but trust me..it was for the best that I left him.....but yea, it sucks to have to cut someone with whom you share so many things, loose.....
SerenityRUS said
Oct 17, 2017
PosiesandPuppies wrote:
KT - I completely understand your share... my AH seems to acknowledge our separation in one moment, and then the next acts like it's just temporary.
Serenity - So good to see your face!! I have missed your posts here. You are right, there is nothing happy about the breakdown of a relationship. Lately, though, I have been feeling oddly disconnected... kind of numb. It is making it hard to make concrete decisions when it comes to my AH and my next steps. Hope your daughter is doing well in college!
My daughter will hopefully survive college and we will hopefully survive each other .. lol .. girl is crazy making .. I feel like I am getting the teenage years now instead of when they should have been and I did mention the troll boy .. god love him I will always think of him as TB ... I have been taking in a LOT of changes at the moment and that oddly disconnected feeling is one I am familiar with ..
My experience has been when I was in a deeply enmeshed relationship of any kind it can be a friendship, romantic, family .. when I separate myself from that person to find my own way because I am healing .. I am confused for lack of a better term .. there is no extra appendage that I am carrying around and there it is a physical loss that I am experiencing. This is just my opinion however something to consider .. after 13 years of marriage and 16 years together .. I forgot what it was like to be me. Not a conjoined part of someone else .. I could tell you what my XAH liked .. however if you asked me what I liked .. I didn't know .. and as I have healed it is easier to answer these things. The journey has now become the woman that my HP intended me to be not the one who got lost in a relationship of someone else. That's the damage of a codie relationship .. I want an interdependent relationship .. not the enmeshment .. that has no enjoyment for me. That now terrifies me actually .. LOL .. I never want to be lost like that again.
Have you done a step 4 and 5 yet? It sounds like an asset list would really be a great place to start to find out who are you, what do you like .. what do you want to do today tomorrow and so on. As far as your X .. all of that will take care of itself .. it's your right to live your life as you see fit and be free from the chains of trying to save someone from themselves because sometimes those people are drowning in a puddle of 3 inch water and all they really need to do is stand up. How crazy is that drowning with another person in 3 inches of water all because I forgot I had the power to stand up. I just decided I wanted more out of life than trying to save someone from 3 inches of water because they truly are gifted with the opportunity to do that for themselves.
Hugs S :)
jitsuka said
Oct 29, 2017
Hope you are OK.
I know what you mean about being in a relationship but not really. The A in my life, she just drinks and drinks. I feel like 'is this it?' I know that this relationship will not last long and I'm just having to wait out a couple of years until I can be a much more viable financial state. I can then build up substantial reserves of money so that I can leave.
I frequently with the A in my life was dead.
Maresie said
Oct 30, 2017
It sounds like the A still wants to act like he is in a relationship (needing the keys to go to a non existent event)
It is true for many of us that is all we know
At the same time never in the history of alcoholism had there been so many options to get better.
There are certainly bariers with money, access and logistics
Therr is help everywhere.
I know for me is absolutely clear with an alcoholic/addict their drug alcohol comes firsr everything else second or not even in the picture
I am no longer willing to subject my whole life to being last on thee list. Change is hard but when I am dealing with any alcoholic I keep that awareness in the forefront.
I dont have to make it easy for them to pretend otherwise.
My life is no longer about sacrificing all my concerns, needs and issues because their's are paramount.
Maresie
PosiesandPuppies said
Oct 30, 2017
Thank you, jitsuka and Maresie for stopping in to check on me. It was a rough week, but, as the Program teaches us, be easy on yourself, understand that each day is it's own day, and another day will certainly come where we can live it!
Hugs to you jitsuka... I have been in your shoes with my AH several times... so I understand the your post.
Maresie said
Oct 31, 2017
I.haveto say that one of the things that stickks put for me in alcoholics is this desire to be forgiven immediately. They fall back on the #I am sick# stuff. I have no one else you are the onky one who is kind to me. I have been taken with that one. The ex A played that one in rotation between me and his mother. His mother moved a few states away, remarried, and
was living in a rural community. The game was played with finesse, he disappears, then he reappears with a desperate need whoch only you can meet. The disappearance is glossed over. You are so primed from the disappearance and relieved that this time he didnt kill himself, you are all ready to do whatever he needs.
Those disappearances are pretty calculated.
I have been over the barrel with them plenty.
The unavailability is key.
I know plenty of alcoholics/addicts who abandoned their children. They are really good at saying I am too sick to help.
They are never too sick to stop drinking or using.
My empathy has to be kept under control. I would give away my last cent. These days I listen very carefully.
Maresie
PosiesandPuppies said
Oct 31, 2017
Maresie - I hear ya!! I am trying very hard to keep my empathy in check. While my AH never went AWOL (with the alcohol), he was always emotionally unavailable, and certainly unavailable to help parent. He DID however, use the "pity card" with me all the time. And if that didn't work, the "you are not supportive enough" card. I REALLY hated that one!!
So the headliner says it all. 29 years. I have been physically separated from my AH for a little over a month... emotionally, perhaps a year.
Last night I had a crying jag. First time I have cried since proclaiming to my AH that it was "Him or me, but someone was leaving the house," in August. It was weird. I know part of this was b/c I was bone tired (I was at my son's band field competition all day -uniform manager).
I had the "pleasure" of many texts and calls from my AH... even one from his sister asking how many times my AH has gone to an event of our sons. I told her not since sophomore year (he is now a senior). Then she tells me, "I thought so, I think that he just wants his car keys back." I finally had to mute both of them b/c I had so much to handle at the time. His last text was please call me.
Once home and showered, I took the time to call him. From the way the phone was "answered," I could tell he was plastered. Sigh. I never said a word. He never really was able to get any coherent words, and finally hung up the phone, only to call back later. The conversation was just a sob-fest from him. A whole lot of "I'm sorry I have done this to you guys." It was gut-wrenching to hear, quite frankly. But I stuck to telling him how his son did/the band did at the competition, and a lot of "I knows." I didn't really know what else to say. I hung up after telling him I will tell his son that he was glad today went well and that he loves him.
That is when the emotions came. I cried on and off for an hour. Cried for his pathetic, current situation, cried over the fact that Sunday will be 29 years, cried over my current situation. I let it all out. Then went to sleep.
Today, I am emotionally low. I am thinking about the anniversary, the legal separation papers I am filing, and the fact that I have gone from panic mode/super emotional state (at time of move-out) to one that is kind of numb.
My AH said something last night to me that has stuck with me... while sobbing to me, he said, "I am sorry, it's just that this (meaning he and I) is all I know!" It made me sad to think that my reality is that I've felt - for all intents and purposes - "single" for a long time, and being a couple is NOT all I know.
Thanks for listening.
Hello,
I am so sorry for your struggle. I am facing a similar situation. I was married for 20 years to my first ah. He passed away 8 years ago leaving me and 5 kids behind. I didn't know about the help of alanon and didn't get proper counseling and here I am remarried to ah #2. I am considering separation as well. My current ah is not ready for help and is lying and sneaking around drinking. I came here because of a crisis that could have resulted in harm to my youngest son involving my ah. My ah has not said he is sorry or taken any responsibility for any of it or any other mean thing spoken or done since we have been married. I know that is the disease but it still hurts. I am still new to all of the help that is available here and thought I would wait longer to make the decision to separate, I am still not 100% sure about doing anything. All of the emotions that you are experiencing are real and I have them too. I hope that things become clearer for both of us over time and that we can truly heal and move forward to a better place.
Hugs to you!
I am sorry you are going through this struggle again. Stick around... I found some peace here, and I feel you might too!
(((Mamakat)))
Be gentle and good to you. You are doing great and you are not alone!
It sounds like his family is on to his manipulations pretty well. That is an incredible achievement.
I could, of course, also make that excuse of this is all I know, much of my life about the situations I found myself in.
At some point i got willing to know something else.
I admire your resolve to make your son's life as normal as possible when you feel so bad. That is an incredible strength.
I know alcoholic's who claim their children are estranged from them. They don't even bother to look at their children's Facebook pages.
I also know alcoholic's who have their children on the weekend. That weekend consists of the child watching the parent drink themselves silly.
Alcoholics can be very very good at getting what they need from others. The alcoholic woman (who is a neighbor) cries all the time she only has her son on the weekend.
He spends his whole time mooching around while she drinks herself to sleep. She puts a considerable effort into appearing "wronged" but really the wrong is in that she refuses to address her alcoholism.
I bought all the manipulations, the constant phone calls, the pleas before. Now I am able to detach from them. I have to say that often I felt the 'sorrow" that the alcoholic could not feel.
These days I feel like I have enough to deal with. I feel sad and very sorry for an alcoholic who does nothing to recover. I no longer believe it is my mission to do something about it.
My whole self worth is not tied up in that.
Boundaries are so important. You are teaching your son so much by having them. What an incredible gift that is.
i look forward to a live with better boundaries and a better ability to be compassionate and kind without taking on the emotions that someone else needs to feel for themselves.
Maresie.
Thank you, Maresie for your insight, and YarnCrazy for your healing thoughts.
It was a tough day... and my AH had the audacity to text me "Happy Anniversary!" Of course I didn't see it until this morning b/c I had blocked him all day yesterday.
Sigh.
Thanks for your honest share. I can relate to how you feel. I have felt "single" myself for a while too. His drinking cycles and so does my ability to have a stable relationship with him. I find I get too attached when things go well and then have to detach when things aren't good. I've been working on that but the process can be quite lonely. I find my AH will have a tiny bit of insight into the problems and trying to fix things and then eventually falls right back into denial. Denial that things in our relationship aren't so great. That we have had any problems in the past. I see this huge discrepancy between what he wants and what the disease wants. He wants our marriage to work but his disease keeps causing problems in our marriage. He can't reconcile these two things and it is very hard to watch someone I love and who I know loves me get taken over by a disease. I went through that grief process recently in a different way. We are still together at the moment but I recently had to accept that my AH and I are never going to be the way we were. Our old life together is gone. I held on for quite a while hoping that if he would just get some help then we could go back to our old relationship. That's not going to happen. I think that if I end up leaving my AH will go through that grief process at that moment too. Even though I feel like I've told him over and over that his drinking is effecting our marriage he won' t see it until it's over. The disease is cunning in that way. It keeps the individual locked in denial so they can keep drinking. I hope that you are doing ok and being gentle with yourself giving yourself time to move through this difficult date. Sending you hugs and strength.
I find that my grief came in waves .. I can remember standing in the grocery store line and tears .. I wasn't sobbing just tears were coming down my face and the poor little checkout gal asked me if I was ok and honestly I totally was .. I just hadn't cried for such a LONG time that I didn't know how to process everything.
The longer things went by the swells in emotions ebbed .. it's all good it's part of healing and it IS sad. There is nothing happy about the breakdown of a relationship especially one so long.
Ironically is Oct 15th is the anniversary of my divorce. LOL .. I joke my pseudo divorce since I had to get redivorced in January of the immediate year after. UGH.
Anyway .. it will pass and hopefully you can both move in whatever direction your HP has planned and I think it's more important your AH get help and you continue to heal.
Hugs S :)
Serenity - So good to see your face!! I have missed your posts here. You are right, there is nothing happy about the breakdown of a relationship. Lately, though, I have been feeling oddly disconnected... kind of numb. It is making it hard to make concrete decisions when it comes to my AH and my next steps. Hope your daughter is doing well in college!
((((((((((((((((((((((PnP)))))))))))))))))))))) 29 years is a long time investment...Of course your gonna cry and miss what could have been, what SHOULD have been...like stability, equality, respect, mutual "flying in the same direction" hanging out and having fun, romance...All of it....I cried when I made my AH #2 leave....what could have been, hit me like a truck when I shipped his stuff to the apt. by the base that he had rented......yea, for me it was 13 married, 17 years all together.......all gone!!! Poof!!!! but it was for the best...I knew then...I know now....doesn't mean I don't miss the fun times we had together.....I don't miss the drunken talking to the tv, yelling at the dogs (he never physically abused them) but he mostly would "complain" to them...don't miss the burned up pots and pans and the sound of him "hurling" his innards from too much Jack and Coke...Beer he wasn't so bad..Wine either., but that hard stuff??? OMG....it was awful....I don't miss the worrying when he was wasted and driving the truck.....I don't miss watching him on a daily basis, toss poison down this throat towards a slow and painful death.....I still think of him, hope is is OK, etc., but trust me..it was for the best that I left him.....but yea, it sucks to have to cut someone with whom you share so many things, loose.....
My daughter will hopefully survive college and we will hopefully survive each other .. lol .. girl is crazy making .. I feel like I am getting the teenage years now instead of when they should have been and I did mention the troll boy .. god love him I will always think of him as TB ... I have been taking in a LOT of changes at the moment and that oddly disconnected feeling is one I am familiar with ..
My experience has been when I was in a deeply enmeshed relationship of any kind it can be a friendship, romantic, family .. when I separate myself from that person to find my own way because I am healing .. I am confused for lack of a better term .. there is no extra appendage that I am carrying around and there it is a physical loss that I am experiencing. This is just my opinion however something to consider .. after 13 years of marriage and 16 years together .. I forgot what it was like to be me. Not a conjoined part of someone else .. I could tell you what my XAH liked .. however if you asked me what I liked .. I didn't know .. and as I have healed it is easier to answer these things. The journey has now become the woman that my HP intended me to be not the one who got lost in a relationship of someone else. That's the damage of a codie relationship .. I want an interdependent relationship .. not the enmeshment .. that has no enjoyment for me. That now terrifies me actually .. LOL .. I never want to be lost like that again.
Have you done a step 4 and 5 yet? It sounds like an asset list would really be a great place to start to find out who are you, what do you like .. what do you want to do today tomorrow and so on. As far as your X .. all of that will take care of itself .. it's your right to live your life as you see fit and be free from the chains of trying to save someone from themselves because sometimes those people are drowning in a puddle of 3 inch water and all they really need to do is stand up. How crazy is that drowning with another person in 3 inches of water all because I forgot I had the power to stand up. I just decided I wanted more out of life than trying to save someone from 3 inches of water because they truly are gifted with the opportunity to do that for themselves.
Hugs S :)
I know what you mean about being in a relationship but not really. The A in my life, she just drinks and drinks. I feel like 'is this it?' I know that this relationship will not last long and I'm just having to wait out a couple of years until I can be a much more viable financial state. I can then build up substantial reserves of money so that I can leave.
I frequently with the A in my life was dead.
It sounds like the A still wants to act like he is in a relationship (needing the keys to go to a non existent event)
It is true for many of us that is all we know
At the same time never in the history of alcoholism had there been so many options to get better.
There are certainly bariers with money, access and logistics
Therr is help everywhere.
I know for me is absolutely clear with an alcoholic/addict their drug alcohol comes firsr everything else second or not even in the picture
I am no longer willing to subject my whole life to being last on thee list. Change is hard but when I am dealing with any alcoholic I keep that awareness in the forefront.
I dont have to make it easy for them to pretend otherwise.
My life is no longer about sacrificing all my concerns, needs and issues because their's are paramount.
Maresie
Hugs to you jitsuka... I have been in your shoes with my AH several times... so I understand the your post.
I.haveto say that one of the things that stickks put for me in alcoholics is this desire to be forgiven immediately. They fall back on the #I am sick# stuff. I have no one else you are the onky one who is kind to me. I have been taken with that one. The ex A played that one in rotation between me and his mother. His mother moved a few states away, remarried, and
was living in a rural community. The game was played with finesse, he disappears, then he reappears with a desperate need whoch only you can meet. The disappearance is glossed over. You are so primed from the disappearance and relieved that this time he didnt kill himself, you are all ready to do whatever he needs.
Those disappearances are pretty calculated.
I have been over the barrel with them plenty.
The unavailability is key.
I know plenty of alcoholics/addicts who abandoned their children. They are really good at saying I am too sick to help.
They are never too sick to stop drinking or using.
My empathy has to be kept under control. I would give away my last cent. These days I listen very carefully.
Maresie
Thank you for giving your ESH!