So, you are in a relationship with someone. You do not live together, but you spend a great deal of time over each other's respective homes. Your SO lives with her two children, one of which, a son, is a heroin addict. So, you have all that going on. The son has a girlfriend who also uses heroin, and drinks. Th girlfriend lived with the son in the mother's house. She didn't work, contribute anything to the household, didn't clean, didn't do a thing. She ate their food, smoked their cigarettes, sat around and did nothing. After a series of incidents, the mother finally threw the son's girlfriend out of the house and banned her from coming back for any reason -- not to spend the night, hang out, watch TV, nothing.
After a couple of weeks, the son starts sneaking the girlfriend into the house -- to spend the day, the night, to hang out with him downstairs in his room. The house is situated in a way that she can be hidden down there and no one would know. She only comes up when the mother leaves for work, is sleeping, etc.
So, whenever I am there, I am awake, the mother/SO is sleeping, and right in front of me, the son walks his GF in. He takes her downstairs, and she's there. He brings her food, cigarettes, etc. -- and the mother doesn't know. The mother and the son are at constant odds due to his heroin use.
So, do I tell her what's going on? Thanks.
Iamhere said
Sep 12, 2017
I don't ever enable anyone for any reason at any time. That's part of my program and recovery. I got 'there' by working this program. I can seriously suggest that I have no desire to be around active disease for any reason no matter what and would run away (not walk) from any scenario as you've described...I value me way more than this today, thanks to Al-Anon.
Lyne said
Sep 12, 2017
In my marriage with my A, her lying and withholding info. Only contributed to a downward spiral as my resentment and anger built. Without honesty and trust, the foundation of our marriage was folding. Now that she is sober 5 months or so, and we are attending couples' counseling with an addiction therapist, we are openly and honestly talking for the first time in many years.
From what you said, your SO was able to throw out the girlfriend, so she has strengths you can remind her of, if you decide to speak to her. Also, I wonder if she would attend an Alanon meeting with you? Or without you? Best of luck with this very difficult situation, Lyne
Bo said
Sep 12, 2017
Iamhere, I hear you and thanks. While I have too have no desire to be around an active addict/alcoholic, sometimes it just happens. I prefered to be over my house instead of hers. When I was there and her son would come home and get into it with her, I would leave. These times were late at night, middle of the night, etc. Son would come home, sneak in his GF, and they would be downstairs. I didn't communicate with them, break bread with them, etc. So do you see this as enabling the mom/my SO? Thanks.
Bo said
Sep 12, 2017
Yes Lyne, she did. It took a very long time. I was proud of her. But I also didn't get involved in all the drama that led up to her throwing her out. I try to be there for her, in a healthy and supportive way. I do remind her of her strength and what she has been able to do, what changes she has made, etc. I've offered the go to a meeting, with or without me. She keeps saying she needs them and wants them. But, she doesn't go. I offered once. Then whenever she asks if she can go. But she doesn't. And I am OK with that.
mamalioness said
Sep 12, 2017
if this were me, I would run, not walk away.....I cannot be around this disease of addiction of any substance and stay healthy....I am "getting" healthy by eliminating unhealthy situations in my life....I know this situation is difficult and the mom had strength to throw out the GF, and I FEEL for her, really however she is letting her son , who also uses, stay...Of course!! HE is her child....so the disease and its tentacles of dysfunction, cheating, lying, and most likely if this continues with her son, legal and financial disasters coming down the pike...This goes on in her house and for anyone connected to it...for me, it would be too toxic....what would I do?? I would be honest and open and very compassionate with mom and just tell her that I can't be around this disease in anyway and suggest she go to Al-anon or Nar-anon ...This scenario obviously bothers you or you wouldn't have brought it here on the boards..I'm glad you are sharing about it..Getting it out...Talking about it....We are as sick as our secrets....Now , if this were me, I would ask me: "Do I want to be around the disease again, even tho it is not my SO, it is her family...Her son..Someone whom she most likely will keep in her life, so therefore it is going to be in my life???" I would examine my expectations of this relationship and are they reasonable and do they meet what I am looking for in a relationship....for me?? I would not want to date or be around ANYONE who is using/drinking OR has it close to them, like in their house, etc., because that would be waaaaay too close to me..Mom is not , most likely , going to give up her boy, she will struggle with him until SHE learns to let him suffer consequences, et al and thats usually after LOTS of Al-anon for HER.........Just saying.......remember "nothing changes if nothing changes" and I can only change me......
Bo said
Sep 12, 2017
Got it. Thanks ML. You know, I viewed what I was doing as OK. Whenever the son comes around, I leave. Whenever they get into it, I leave. When mom doesn't have money (because she covered her son, regardless of what it was for), I don't give or loan any. When they had family dinners -- I wouldn't go. It caused a lot of hostility between me and her, but so be it.
I was being myopic and just looking at whether or not to tell mom that her son is sneaking the GF into the house every night. Thanks again.
mamalioness said
Sep 12, 2017
((((((((((Bo)))))))))))) No worries, glad I could toss some food for thought into this......If I found ME having to leave and detach and leave some more and detach some more because my SO has an albatross tied around her neck and TODAY, she is not ready to cut loose this albatross, I would have to examine MY expectations...MY needs in this relationship.....right now it would be too "high maintainance" for me re: the having to remove me and detach me from all the insanity...... AND, I just got OUT of a relationship where there was addiction and here I am back in one where its not HER, but whose the closest thing to her but her SON and HE is using...AND cheating on mom by sneaking GF back into house....Again!! I would check my motives for staying, and my expectations, what do I want/need in a relationship.....Mom is gonna stand by her boy as of TODAY!!! MAYBE , after long time in recovery, she MAY be able to let him to his own devices/suffer the consequences, but that is NOT Today or next week...So how long would I want to gamble on this?? for me??? I would choose to gently and lovingly tell her why you have to for NOW and perhaps the long term, leave because being around the disease in anyway would be just too much for me....I would not be able to handle a relationship like this...I would most likely be 2nd to her son who is an active user with all its troubles and heartache that addiction brings with it.............this is just my ESH...........been in this situation and I chose to leave because as I said....I cannot...will not be around the disease in anyway....its just too heavy of a weight for me as I work my program to stay emotionally sober.......just saying MY ESH.......I'm glad you brought this to the board....we all need to view the sky with another's telescope because we can get myopic and monolithic in our thinking no matter how long we've been here.......................hugs of support
Bo said
Sep 12, 2017
Thanks Rose! I always appreciate your experience, insight, and perspective.
mamalioness said
Sep 12, 2017
No worries...Glad I saw this....and glad you are thinking about what is best/right thing for you...
el-cee said
Sep 12, 2017
Its a tricky one, and to be honest I don't see it as the main issue. I mean the Mother may need some recovery herself living with an addicted son cant be easy and im sure the girlfriend is the tip of the iceberg. I might be wrong but an addicted son usually equals a whole list of chaos. Can you encourage the Mother to go to Nar Anon maybe? Otherwise, its not your business and the Mother is very likely in denial selecting exactly what she knows is going on and what isnt. For me, Im more concerned about you, sounds like a whole lot of dysfunction to get yourself tangled up with while in recovery and in the persuit of peace and serenity.
milkwood said
Sep 12, 2017
I would feel uncomfortable in the situation you've described Bo because my choices would be either to be complicit in the flaunting of house rules and do nothing, or likely cause an argument between mother and son by bringing the g/f visits to mom's attention. It's the nature of living alongside addiction I guess - a rock and a hard place with a current that sucks you right into the middle!
If I wanted to continue the relationship with my SO I would, for my own peace of mind, speak up, quite lightly, about my discomfort at the situation in a respectful non-accusatory way, preferably to the son with the mum present. Of course I would be the least popular person in the room at that point, but I'm ok with that! I would try to keep front of mind that it is up to others where their boundaries are etc. When/if the shouting starts I would simply leave the room/house and touch base with SO later to explain why I won't be placed in that situation again and what steps I propose to take to avoid it.
PS . I would need to check my motive for why I wanted to say anything though. Depending on my relationship with SO I guess I might just jump to the finish and explain why I don't stay in that type of situation.
-- Edited by milkwood on Tuesday 12th of September 2017 10:15:53 AM
-- Edited by milkwood on Tuesday 12th of September 2017 10:21:28 AM
Iamhere said
Sep 12, 2017
Keeping anyone from their bottom is enabling based on my willingness to keep things simple. If you are keeping the truth from the SO, this may be affecting her bottom as well as that of her son.
As we all know, denial in this disease is huge. The SO has booted the GF well within her rights yet she's still harboring her own son. I've BTDT - Been There - Done That - trying to control the disease and the diseased by controlling who they can see and it did not work. As I said, I love me way too much to be in the throws of this scenario....yes - it does happen and I would not wish it on anyone. Yet, today, there are healthier people for me to spend time with and to enjoy.
In my experience, a home with addiction has way too much chaos and denial for me to be me. I no longer choose to be where I have to filter my words, thoughts, emotions, etc. It just creates all kinds of emotional relapse potential within me. My motives are pure/simple - sanity and self preservation.
Keep in mind - if anyone, any where reaches out for help, I will help and provide service as I can. In this scenario, nobody is asking for help....it's just a ticking time-bomb based on what you describe.
Bo said
Sep 12, 2017
I can see that -- thanks. Who knows what would have happened if I told her. I don't think it would have helped her hit bottom as it was nothing more than telling her the GF was being snuck into the house -- that is, her son breaking a rule. All he did was break rules, LOL. Anyway, while I chose not to tell her, I viewed it as a "my side of the street" thing -- and back when this was going on, my GF was very selective as to what truths she would and would not see. When her other kids told her what they found -- syringes, bloody paper-towels, their sibling being high, etc. -- their mother yelled at them! She was in denial. While I did not tell her this, I did tell her other similar things. I too got yelled at. LOL.
I was thinking this through now because recent text messages from her were "blaming" me for not telling her. I think my disclosures to her were at a time where she was not ready to hear or see the truth. I am told today she has and that she's doing well. I am glad she has gotten better and gotten healthy perhaps. Thanks again.
Jerry F said
Sep 12, 2017
What I have are questions which is what and how my sponsor helped me to get straight. "What's your part in the problem?", "What are you getting out of it?", Who's problem is it and have you been invited and asked by all involved to create a solution for them all?". "Are you doing the same thing you have done before in past relationships that didn't work out expecting that it will now work?". You are getting something you like out of this relationship other wise you wouldn't be there. If you were not what would you be doing?" go over the answers to the questions with your sponsor and see what he comes up with. (((hugs)))
a4l said
Sep 13, 2017
Something I learned early on in recovery was to use I statements. I feel, I have seen, etc. Although simple, I find it really helps to frame the issue from a healthier place with the focus on me, which is where we are encouraged to begin. I suggest trying it, even simple change can lead to new answers, but first we must ask new questions.
Mattie said
Sep 13, 2017
I think I would have told - keeping secrets has not been good for me. If the son doesn't want his mother to know, he shouldn't do it. I would also feel weird if my partner saw something like that and did not tell me. But the real problem, of course, is all the addicts in this situation. Those are the ultimate thing to deal with, whether the truth came out early or late.
So, you are in a relationship with someone. You do not live together, but you spend a great deal of time over each other's respective homes. Your SO lives with her two children, one of which, a son, is a heroin addict. So, you have all that going on. The son has a girlfriend who also uses heroin, and drinks. Th girlfriend lived with the son in the mother's house. She didn't work, contribute anything to the household, didn't clean, didn't do a thing. She ate their food, smoked their cigarettes, sat around and did nothing. After a series of incidents, the mother finally threw the son's girlfriend out of the house and banned her from coming back for any reason -- not to spend the night, hang out, watch TV, nothing.
After a couple of weeks, the son starts sneaking the girlfriend into the house -- to spend the day, the night, to hang out with him downstairs in his room. The house is situated in a way that she can be hidden down there and no one would know. She only comes up when the mother leaves for work, is sleeping, etc.
So, whenever I am there, I am awake, the mother/SO is sleeping, and right in front of me, the son walks his GF in. He takes her downstairs, and she's there. He brings her food, cigarettes, etc. -- and the mother doesn't know. The mother and the son are at constant odds due to his heroin use.
So, do I tell her what's going on? Thanks.
From what you said, your SO was able to throw out the girlfriend, so she has strengths you can remind her of, if you decide to speak to her. Also, I wonder if she would attend an Alanon meeting with you? Or without you? Best of luck with this very difficult situation, Lyne
if this were me, I would run, not walk away.....I cannot be around this disease of addiction of any substance and stay healthy....I am "getting" healthy by eliminating unhealthy situations in my life....I know this situation is difficult and the mom had strength to throw out the GF, and I FEEL for her, really however she is letting her son , who also uses, stay...Of course!! HE is her child....so the disease and its tentacles of dysfunction, cheating, lying, and most likely if this continues with her son, legal and financial disasters coming down the pike...This goes on in her house and for anyone connected to it...for me, it would be too toxic....what would I do?? I would be honest and open and very compassionate with mom and just tell her that I can't be around this disease in anyway and suggest she go to Al-anon or Nar-anon ...This scenario obviously bothers you or you wouldn't have brought it here on the boards..I'm glad you are sharing about it..Getting it out...Talking about it....We are as sick as our secrets....Now , if this were me, I would ask me: "Do I want to be around the disease again, even tho it is not my SO, it is her family...Her son..Someone whom she most likely will keep in her life, so therefore it is going to be in my life???" I would examine my expectations of this relationship and are they reasonable and do they meet what I am looking for in a relationship....for me?? I would not want to date or be around ANYONE who is using/drinking OR has it close to them, like in their house, etc., because that would be waaaaay too close to me..Mom is not , most likely , going to give up her boy, she will struggle with him until SHE learns to let him suffer consequences, et al and thats usually after LOTS of Al-anon for HER.........Just saying.......remember "nothing changes if nothing changes" and I can only change me......
I was being myopic and just looking at whether or not to tell mom that her son is sneaking the GF into the house every night. Thanks again.
No worries...Glad I saw this....and glad you are thinking about what is best/right thing for you...
Its a tricky one, and to be honest I don't see it as the main issue. I mean the Mother may need some recovery herself living with an addicted son cant be easy and im sure the girlfriend is the tip of the iceberg. I might be wrong but an addicted son usually equals a whole list of chaos. Can you encourage the Mother to go to Nar Anon maybe? Otherwise, its not your business and the Mother is very likely in denial selecting exactly what she knows is going on and what isnt. For me, Im more concerned about you, sounds like a whole lot of dysfunction to get yourself tangled up with while in recovery and in the persuit of peace and serenity.
I would feel uncomfortable in the situation you've described Bo because my choices would be either to be complicit in the flaunting of house rules and do nothing, or likely cause an argument between mother and son by bringing the g/f visits to mom's attention. It's the nature of living alongside addiction I guess - a rock and a hard place with a current that sucks you right into the middle!
If I wanted to continue the relationship with my SO I would, for my own peace of mind, speak up, quite lightly, about my discomfort at the situation in a respectful non-accusatory way, preferably to the son with the mum present. Of course I would be the least popular person in the room at that point, but I'm ok with that! I would try to keep front of mind that it is up to others where their boundaries are etc. When/if the shouting starts I would simply leave the room/house and touch base with SO later to explain why I won't be placed in that situation again and what steps I propose to take to avoid it.
PS . I would need to check my motive for why I wanted to say anything though. Depending on my relationship with SO I guess I might just jump to the finish and explain why I don't stay in that type of situation.
-- Edited by milkwood on Tuesday 12th of September 2017 10:15:53 AM
-- Edited by milkwood on Tuesday 12th of September 2017 10:21:28 AM
As we all know, denial in this disease is huge. The SO has booted the GF well within her rights yet she's still harboring her own son. I've BTDT - Been There - Done That - trying to control the disease and the diseased by controlling who they can see and it did not work. As I said, I love me way too much to be in the throws of this scenario....yes - it does happen and I would not wish it on anyone. Yet, today, there are healthier people for me to spend time with and to enjoy.
In my experience, a home with addiction has way too much chaos and denial for me to be me. I no longer choose to be where I have to filter my words, thoughts, emotions, etc. It just creates all kinds of emotional relapse potential within me. My motives are pure/simple - sanity and self preservation.
Keep in mind - if anyone, any where reaches out for help, I will help and provide service as I can. In this scenario, nobody is asking for help....it's just a ticking time-bomb based on what you describe.
I was thinking this through now because recent text messages from her were "blaming" me for not telling her. I think my disclosures to her were at a time where she was not ready to hear or see the truth. I am told today she has and that she's doing well. I am glad she has gotten better and gotten healthy perhaps. Thanks again.
What I have are questions which is what and how my sponsor helped me to get straight. "What's your part in the problem?", "What are you getting out of it?", Who's problem is it and have you been invited and asked by all involved to create a solution for them all?". "Are you doing the same thing you have done before in past relationships that didn't work out expecting that it will now work?". You are getting something you like out of this relationship other wise you wouldn't be there. If you were not what would you be doing?" go over the answers to the questions with your sponsor and see what he comes up with.
(((hugs)))
I think I would have told - keeping secrets has not been good for me. If the son doesn't want his mother to know, he shouldn't do it. I would also feel weird if my partner saw something like that and did not tell me. But the real problem, of course, is all the addicts in this situation. Those are the ultimate thing to deal with, whether the truth came out early or late.