Hi, brand new here. Looked through the sticky posts and didn't see this covered, but I'm fairly upset and may have just missed it -- please point me in the right direction if so, and I apologize.
So, my wife is a high-functioning alcoholic who's been sober for 2+ years. She was able to hold down a high-pressure job, and still does, but drinking, especially after work and on the way home (mass transit) was her coping mechanism, and she drank a LOT, and it was not great around here when she did.
Her sobriety has been really good for her, and for us. We're closer; she's spending more time with the kids; she also spends a lot of time in online meetings. She's been a rock star, as far as I can tell, running her own meeting, having a sponsee, etc. Her recovery has been the most important thing to her.
So out of nowhere, she calls me from one nearby train station today asking me to get her and take her to the other one, where her car was. This happens occasionally -- sometimes I drive her to the train and other times she drives herself, and her parking permit is for one station, but if I drive her, we use the other one, and we just came off a couple of weeks of her car being in the shop and me driving her instead, so accidentally getting off at the wrong stop wasn't out of the question. So I suspected nothing was wrong, and when she got in the car and I immediately smelled the wine on her, I actually assumed (and almost asked if) someone had spilled on her. But then I realized she wasn't able to get her seat belt on, and realized what was going on, right as she was telling me to just go home and not take her to her car.
We drove home in silence, and she threw up all over the garage the instant she got out of the car. I eventually got her cleaned up and in bed, without the kids seeing, though the garage may never be the same again. She said something like "please don't tonight," which I took to mean she didn't want to discuss it yet, and said a lot about how much she loved me, which I reacted favorably to, because I know being obviously angry with her just then wasn't going to help.
So finally, we get to my question: what the hell do I say and not say to her when she's sober in the morning (or, more likely knowing her, when she wakes me up at 3 am?) I know relapse is a part of recovery (though a part I was thankful we'd so far avoided) so I'm not "oh my god it's hopeless and we're back to how awful it used to be when she drank all the time" about it, but I want to make sure SHE doesn't go down that path of feeling it's all futile -- I want her to want to be (and to actually be) back in her meetings and working her program, and being successful at sobriety again.
Thanks.
WestMan said
Aug 18, 2017
This is a great question. My AW relapsed almost immediately. She said the longest she made it was thirty days. I didn't know what to say so kept my mouth shut. She's continued drinking since and I still haven't said anything about it. Just trying to double down on Al Anon.
Jbella said
Aug 18, 2017
This is my sister too. 2 days out of rehab, drunk, 2 more days drunk. She's been out of rehab for 7 days and has relapsed 2 times already that I am aware of. I hear you and ask the same questions, what do you say, how do you say it? My fear is saying the wrong thing and triggering her and her anger. You feel helpless...
Bo said
Aug 18, 2017
I am sorry this happened, and that you are facing this -- but there is her and her decision, recovery...and then there is yours. You said "but I want to make sure SHE doesn't go down that path of feeling it's all futile -- I want her to want to be (and to actually be) back in her meetings and working her program, and being successful at sobriety again."
Other than what you want -- which doesn't come into play, because there is nothing you can do about this -- this is up to her. She relapsed. What does she want to do? Is she going to pull herself up and start sobriety again, be in recovery, etc. -- or is she not? That is up to her.
What can you say? In my experience, you can think about -- mind your own business, not tell her what you want, not try to force your will or your want, and be there for her in a healthy and supportive way. What she wants will be crystal clear from day one. When she decides...then you can decide. Focus on YOU.
Be neutral. Be there, again, in a healthy and supportive way. Talk to your sponsor. Go to more meetings. Keep coming back.
Mattie said
Aug 18, 2017
I don't know if "relapse is part of recovery." A lot of people I know with longterm recovery under their belts have never relapsed. Of course, some have, and got right back into recovery.
I guess my somewhat cynical view is because my A ex-husband would go for months and months - a couple times, years - sober, and then he would relapse. I kept waiting for the time he would stay in recovery. It never happened. "Relapse is part of recovery" he would say nonchalantly. Then the times between relapses got shorter. Then no time at all between drinking. He's still drinking, though he's no longer my husband.
Anyway, that doesn't predict anything about your wife. I would say that she knows what to do if she wants to get back into recovery. You are in a prime position to observe and see if she does it. Does she immediately go back to her meeting, does she get hold of her sponsor, does she work her program just as hard if not harder? Or ... does she not?
Also, what was Plan B if she had not gone into recovery, two years ago? Did you have a plan to separate, or whatever? Not that you need to mention Plan B. But you can have it in your back pocket, for your own serenity. You can tell yourself, "I don't have to force her to go back into recovery or hector her into it. I will be okay whatever her choice is. Her choice is hers alone. I will okay."
If I were in your position, I wouldn't feel the need to say anything in particular. If she brings it up, you can "say what you mean, mean what you say, and don't say it mean." If my partner were apologetic and needy, my own response would have been, "Yes, that was hard on me. I'll manage, but it sure was. I'm just waiting to see what happens next." She'll probably want all kinds of assurances that you still love her, that you won't leave, etc. But it doesn't help her to proetct her from the consequences and to pretend it's no big deal - because it is a big deal. You can be calm about it, but it's not like drinking doesn't affect your situation. So I wouldn't conceal that from her.
Hope you'll take good care of yourself.
Jerry F said
Aug 18, 2017
Gracious what a post; turning on the lights in my memory both of when my alcoholic/addict wife relapsed and when I also relapsed in my two part recovery. I didn't go back to drinking and I did go back to the drinker user with the same old non-working behaviors I had when I finally got into the program, found my seat and stayed to listen and practice.
What did I say when she relapsed? I had accepted that this disease is incurable and fatal if not arrested by total abstinence so I learned what empathy and compassion was and how to work that along with acceptance and understanding. To the disease I wasn't a big deal so humility also came along with the steps. Without and before the program I was the most toxic partner in the marriage and she was fearful that not only would the drinking kill her and I was a very close second.
I am grateful for the slogans "When in Doubt Don't" and "Don't React" along with the early 3 steps. My Higher Power held me when I was relapsing and wishing that nothing super serious would happen to me as a consequence of my thoughts, feelings and behaviors. I never got locked up or in a fatal wreck. I wasn't ever shot nor did I ever shoot anyone else. We live with and in insanity and get more choices to do it different which works for us if we don't relapse into old thoughts, feelings and actions.
Best thing I said to my spouse when she was out of it was Do you need help? and then nothing else. When in Doubt...."
((((hugs))))
Jill said
Aug 18, 2017
Oh I used to practice the perfect description of how his drinking again affected me, us, the world, etc. If I had practiced in front of a brick wall, it would have had the same effect.
After a lot of work and wisdom from Alanon meetings, I now remember
- he is sick
- the 3 C's: I didn't cause it, I can't cure it, and I can't control it
- when in doubt, Don'T
With these, I can stay on a steadier course.
I'm no longer the enemy to administer punishment. How worthless that was anyway!
I value my path more than I did when I was entrenched in someone else's rut. Ick
I found my meetings were even more important than in smooth times.
Keep coming back.
bud said
Aug 19, 2017
I'm sorry you're going through this. I have come to believe that it isn't necessary to comment or offer thoughts on many things, but to turn inward and ask myself what it is that I need. What steps do I need to take for myself that will give me what I need... or just what is the next right step for me?
Iamhere said
Aug 19, 2017
Welcome to MIP float - glad you found us and glad you posted a share! The disease is powerful and progressive. It's never cured but can be treated through abstaining and some type of a recovery process. It's considered a family disease and almost all are affected by it - distorted thinking, low self-esteem, low self-worth - just a few of the ways it affects family and friends who care.
In my world, even when I have felt badly, mad or defeated, I try to remember that it's a disease. As such, if I find a reason to even say anything, I will usually say, I am so sorry that happened. I have a friend who is fighting cancer for the second time. It was very sad, shocking and devastating when it returned and I recall not sure what to say....I used our program, which suggests I pause, pray and consider next best step(s)....what came to me was, "I am so, so sorry this has happened - how can I be of service."
These 14 words have stayed with me and I've used them for this disease too. I suggest you seek out some local F2F (Face-to-Face) Al-Anon meetings. I have found my recovery path through Al-Anon, and it's been a great journey for me to heal and deal with this disease and the affects. We use literature, meetings, slogans, and sponsorship, much like AA to work on ourselves and find our way back to a saner way of living.
Keep coming back - there is hope and help in recovery!
mamalioness said
Aug 20, 2017
Hi , glad you are here........wow!!! what a question....my take is "DON"T" say anything...its her disease...her relapse...her recovery , IF she goes..hopefully she will get back up, start over and get back into recovery....but the bottom line is....its totally out of your power....this is HER path....HER make it or break it time in her life......you have your Al-anon...I would increase my meetings...increase my working MY program, more talks with my sponsor or recovery mate, and DETACH DETACH DETACH.....remember steps 1,2,3.....hang with those and I would say nothing....if she brings it up, I would just kindly let her know that this is her path, her lesson, and much as you love her, you are gonna get out of the way, work your program and let her work hers....I would never beg or plead or use insults, etc....it won't do any good....she relapsed...she can pick herself up and begin again....and that is where I would leave it......some folks relapse over and over again...some don't......its a roll of the dice, but I think the ones who reeeeely make it are the ones who constantly work their program, never let up, never get too "confident" etc...the ones who KNOW, they are one day at a time, sober are in the best percentile of making it.....
serenity47 said
Aug 24, 2017
When our daughter relapsed, once she surfaced and I knew she was safe I simply said I'm sorry that happened, its not the end of the world, I hope you get back up in the saddle again. She was initially angry that I had called the police when there was no contact. I responded that's what I needed to do to put my mind at ease. She got on with her own recovery, I got on with mine and did my best to stay out of her business. She says now that it was a good learning experience for her.
Hi, brand new here. Looked through the sticky posts and didn't see this covered, but I'm fairly upset and may have just missed it -- please point me in the right direction if so, and I apologize.
So, my wife is a high-functioning alcoholic who's been sober for 2+ years. She was able to hold down a high-pressure job, and still does, but drinking, especially after work and on the way home (mass transit) was her coping mechanism, and she drank a LOT, and it was not great around here when she did.
Her sobriety has been really good for her, and for us. We're closer; she's spending more time with the kids; she also spends a lot of time in online meetings. She's been a rock star, as far as I can tell, running her own meeting, having a sponsee, etc. Her recovery has been the most important thing to her.
So out of nowhere, she calls me from one nearby train station today asking me to get her and take her to the other one, where her car was. This happens occasionally -- sometimes I drive her to the train and other times she drives herself, and her parking permit is for one station, but if I drive her, we use the other one, and we just came off a couple of weeks of her car being in the shop and me driving her instead, so accidentally getting off at the wrong stop wasn't out of the question. So I suspected nothing was wrong, and when she got in the car and I immediately smelled the wine on her, I actually assumed (and almost asked if) someone had spilled on her. But then I realized she wasn't able to get her seat belt on, and realized what was going on, right as she was telling me to just go home and not take her to her car.
We drove home in silence, and she threw up all over the garage the instant she got out of the car. I eventually got her cleaned up and in bed, without the kids seeing, though the garage may never be the same again. She said something like "please don't tonight," which I took to mean she didn't want to discuss it yet, and said a lot about how much she loved me, which I reacted favorably to, because I know being obviously angry with her just then wasn't going to help.
So finally, we get to my question: what the hell do I say and not say to her when she's sober in the morning (or, more likely knowing her, when she wakes me up at 3 am?) I know relapse is a part of recovery (though a part I was thankful we'd so far avoided) so I'm not "oh my god it's hopeless and we're back to how awful it used to be when she drank all the time" about it, but I want to make sure SHE doesn't go down that path of feeling it's all futile -- I want her to want to be (and to actually be) back in her meetings and working her program, and being successful at sobriety again.
Thanks.
Other than what you want -- which doesn't come into play, because there is nothing you can do about this -- this is up to her. She relapsed. What does she want to do? Is she going to pull herself up and start sobriety again, be in recovery, etc. -- or is she not? That is up to her.
What can you say? In my experience, you can think about -- mind your own business, not tell her what you want, not try to force your will or your want, and be there for her in a healthy and supportive way. What she wants will be crystal clear from day one. When she decides...then you can decide. Focus on YOU.
Be neutral. Be there, again, in a healthy and supportive way. Talk to your sponsor. Go to more meetings. Keep coming back.
I don't know if "relapse is part of recovery." A lot of people I know with longterm recovery under their belts have never relapsed. Of course, some have, and got right back into recovery.
I guess my somewhat cynical view is because my A ex-husband would go for months and months - a couple times, years - sober, and then he would relapse. I kept waiting for the time he would stay in recovery. It never happened. "Relapse is part of recovery" he would say nonchalantly. Then the times between relapses got shorter. Then no time at all between drinking. He's still drinking, though he's no longer my husband.
Anyway, that doesn't predict anything about your wife. I would say that she knows what to do if she wants to get back into recovery. You are in a prime position to observe and see if she does it. Does she immediately go back to her meeting, does she get hold of her sponsor, does she work her program just as hard if not harder? Or ... does she not?
Also, what was Plan B if she had not gone into recovery, two years ago? Did you have a plan to separate, or whatever? Not that you need to mention Plan B. But you can have it in your back pocket, for your own serenity. You can tell yourself, "I don't have to force her to go back into recovery or hector her into it. I will be okay whatever her choice is. Her choice is hers alone. I will okay."
If I were in your position, I wouldn't feel the need to say anything in particular. If she brings it up, you can "say what you mean, mean what you say, and don't say it mean." If my partner were apologetic and needy, my own response would have been, "Yes, that was hard on me. I'll manage, but it sure was. I'm just waiting to see what happens next." She'll probably want all kinds of assurances that you still love her, that you won't leave, etc. But it doesn't help her to proetct her from the consequences and to pretend it's no big deal - because it is a big deal. You can be calm about it, but it's not like drinking doesn't affect your situation. So I wouldn't conceal that from her.
Hope you'll take good care of yourself.
Gracious what a post; turning on the lights in my memory both of when my alcoholic/addict wife relapsed and when I also relapsed in my two part recovery. I didn't go back to drinking and I did go back to the drinker user with the same old non-working behaviors I had when I finally got into the program, found my seat and stayed to listen and practice.
What did I say when she relapsed? I had accepted that this disease is incurable and fatal if not arrested by total abstinence so I learned what empathy and compassion was and how to work that along with acceptance and understanding. To the disease I wasn't a big deal so humility also came along with the steps. Without and before the program I was the most toxic partner in the marriage and she was fearful that not only would the drinking kill her and I was a very close second.
I am grateful for the slogans "When in Doubt Don't" and "Don't React" along with the early 3 steps. My Higher Power held me when I was relapsing and wishing that nothing super serious would happen to me as a consequence of my thoughts, feelings and behaviors. I never got locked up or in a fatal wreck. I wasn't ever shot nor did I ever shoot anyone else. We live with and in insanity and get more choices to do it different which works for us if we don't relapse into old thoughts, feelings and actions.
Best thing I said to my spouse when she was out of it was Do you need help? and then nothing else. When in Doubt...."
((((hugs))))
After a lot of work and wisdom from Alanon meetings, I now remember
- he is sick
- the 3 C's: I didn't cause it, I can't cure it, and I can't control it
- when in doubt, Don'T
With these, I can stay on a steadier course.
I'm no longer the enemy to administer punishment. How worthless that was anyway!
I value my path more than I did when I was entrenched in someone else's rut. Ick
I found my meetings were even more important than in smooth times.
Keep coming back.
In my world, even when I have felt badly, mad or defeated, I try to remember that it's a disease. As such, if I find a reason to even say anything, I will usually say, I am so sorry that happened. I have a friend who is fighting cancer for the second time. It was very sad, shocking and devastating when it returned and I recall not sure what to say....I used our program, which suggests I pause, pray and consider next best step(s)....what came to me was, "I am so, so sorry this has happened - how can I be of service."
These 14 words have stayed with me and I've used them for this disease too. I suggest you seek out some local F2F (Face-to-Face) Al-Anon meetings. I have found my recovery path through Al-Anon, and it's been a great journey for me to heal and deal with this disease and the affects. We use literature, meetings, slogans, and sponsorship, much like AA to work on ourselves and find our way back to a saner way of living.
Keep coming back - there is hope and help in recovery!