ODAT Reading for July 22 speaks about trying to understand the disease of alcoholism. It points out that reading scientific books on the disease, unless we are professionals in the field, will give us no additional information because nothing will be gained by an in-depth study of the disease. It points out that accepting that this is a disease we are living with is  helpful and not trying to find reasons why the alcoholic's  behavior is unacceptable  while our own conduct shows we are not entirely rational.

So again all change must begin with us. The reading points out that the search should be for our own serenity which will prove to have remarkable power to inspire others.
It is important to note that our own serenity is not contingent upon the alcoholic behavior. If we read up on alcoholism because we hope we can find a way to make our partner  stop and if we  blame the adversities on the alcoholics, we must have the courage to face our own mistakes and we cannot justify our resentments and rationalize our self-pity

The quote is from Marcus:" how much trouble he avoids who does not look to see what others say only what he does himself that it may be just and pure."

Powerful words and so true

 Hey Betty...interesting ODAT...like i see this as a warning about the "paralysis of analysis" mode we can get into, trying to figure out someone else, so we can "change/control" them??  not gonna happen as I have found out so many times.... yea, I like to do research, I am a questioning mind to begin with, wanting to learn learn learn, but some issues are just so complex...I have enough of a burden working on, understanding, accepting ME with MY issues....I see that change has to begin and stay with me.....I do want to understand how do I take care of me and stay halfway level in such a chaotic world....However I have really narrowed down my "close circle" because I am done with drama and chaos....I want to avoid it as much as possible.............nice share, Betty, thanks for your service

Aloha Betty and thanks for the post on the ODAT reading.  I have read it before and will again later.  It reminds me of early Al-Anon and my experiences with my sponsor and the encouragement from him and others to look to and learn as much as I could about the disease so that I could come to understand "what happened, what it was like then and what became of it later".  I am naturally analytical which was and is a part of me since birth and I had real questions one being, "Why am  I the color I am"? for years I passed the greenish color off as being jaundiced and later with the help of others (many) including an Al-Anon sister I found out not.  I became that color as a consequence of alcohol and then 5 years into Al-Anon changed back into my local tan.  Alcohol consumption and the consequences of it physically and neurologically cause the alteration.  Did I need the information in order to establish a more supportive relationship with my alcoholic/addict wife?...only partly.  The information got me into AA also and also to keep my drinking away from her and others.

I came to understand the inter-reaction between the body and alcoholism and the compulsion and allergy often to be helpful with medical professionals that didn't know as much.  Many medical professionals had no idea about what is/was killing my alcoholic/addict spouse until they got a demo of how violently strong alcohol is and that with the alcoholic often times it wasn't necessary to drink it to be negatively affected.  I accompanied her to medical therapy sessions to inform them and that could cause them to be upset until they witnessed the outcomes of not listening.  On occasion she would tell them to get me into the room because the treatment was going wrong and she was having a severe reaction.   You don't have to drink alcohol to be affected and it doesn't need to get thru your stomach in order to get drunk.

The information I learned helped me to be a very good therapist both from college and the rooms of Al-Anon.  It's how and why you use it and how appropriate you are with it.  That last part for me is the HP part.

Thanks so much for your ESH.   ((((HUGS)))) 

 ((((((((((((Betty)))))))))))  I took a page from your book and with my older sister, I (long distance)  show up with love and compassion and enjoy the peace we made with each other this past 2 years.......

 WOW!! ((((Jerry)))) you just taught me something I didn't know....that alcohol can change your COLOR as well...so the alcoholism is the result of an allergy???  why some folks can get trashed every now and again and not get addicted and the others who mess with it get hooked.....I remember my aunt telling me my mother never touched the stuff until she married the deviant...then he wanted her to pose for porno flicks he wanted to make and she refused...he plied her with alcohol to "loosen her up" and she got hooked and then, after destroying her,  he condemned her for HIS pouring the stuff down her while he could drink and control himself, and didn't seem to be addicted.....and us kids...little kids, we were, not drinking but severely affected...my little brother, the youngest began experimenting with LSD way back in 1971 when we went to my oldest brother's wedding...I was scared out of my mind when he told me he "dropped acid"   yea, I used to smoke pot but could take it or leave it...

I became a Co-addict, instead..my drug is having to be in control...And I think the "power" I feel when tossing a big anger tantrum , the "high" of it is like "wow, I feel strong--in control" when I realized that I was actually addicted to the "high" of being majorally pissed, I began working the steps on my anger...It still rears its head, but now, I catch it and do self talk and make me step back and BREATHE....it helps..I can still show anger that is "more then what the trigger deserves" but awareness and fair discipline to me has helped......

Little brother escalated and got majorally hooked on ANYthing that speeds you up, then brings ya down to "mellow land"  I heard, from my terminally ill sister, that he is a street person, doing heroine and meth, big time.....what a mess....the next brother up is the alcoholic that I am real close to, but had to distance myself from because I just don't want to be, anymore, around anything alcoholic.....

thank you for your enlightening post.....I have learned so much, hanging out here......so are you an addiction therapist???  Bet your real real good...to take what was such a dark time for you and to reverse it into something good , helping others,  I am proud to call you friend.......HUGS 

Mama I no longer work (getting paid) as an alcoholic/addiction therapist giving it away only in the rooms.  The "green color was really and urine color" and I wasn't the only one heard of to have that phenomenon.  If you want to understand more I will PM you.  Alcoholism is surely cunning, powerful and baffling.  (((hugs)))..

I agree Jerry. The ODAT is suggesting that(unless we are in the field as professionals- nothing will be gained by attempting to discover the "why" or "how' of the disease in another. We have enough to do to examine our motives so that we do not get caught up in attempting to manipulate the alcoholic into changing.I can understand why you were concerned with being Green
The reading suggest that we keep the focus on our own behavior and use alanon tools to change our responses,actions and motives.

I have found that to be a great reason to keep coming back

Thanks Betty I smile and laugh at your response as I remember the "ladies of the room" re-raising me at the age of 37 being such a know it all and unable to arrive at the solutions which were set right in front of me in the literature and shares of the fellowship.  It honestly is the ESH inside of the rooms and face to face with my sponsor and the other elders of the program that I credit for my peace of mind and serenity.   Mahalo so much for yours.   ((((hugs)))) 

(((((Jerry))))) yep, the ESH and love I get here and other rooms has been my therapy and it is helping me big tme....I would love to hear more about what you said above, PM me any ole time...I see me "growing" compassion for the alcoholic and his/her plight...yea, I get angry because my brother and good buddy won't get help, but would rather drink himself into oblivion, but the anger is only because I love him as my brother and good buddy...We used to date eachother's friends...hung out a lot together before I moved to CA and TX......

I would love to understand more,  PM me AOT  (any ole time)  HUGS of gratitude

((((Betty)))) as usual, you made so much sense in your post, saying that unless we are professionals, we got enough work, examining our motives re: possibly wanting to manipulate the alcoholic...I've tried to maniuplate my bro. to stop...I quit doing that..He has the right to walk his path...even if it is a most unhealthy and life threatening one....He ended up in hospital a few months ago from pneumonia...caught it on a ship he was doing "sea trials" on and they examined him, of course, and said his liver was enlarged, and told him it was due to his alcoholism..I was hoping that would frighten him into quitting....I really think the thing that is saving him thus far is that he eats like a bear out of hibernation...he will eat anythign that does not eat him first...maybe the large food apetite is keeping the alcohol from expediting his progression into ill health....dunno...I have to let him walk his path....I am striving to understand and help ME.....a full time job......grateful hugs for your service on this board......Glad you are back here posting...Missed you, my friend....