Sobriety for the alcoholic or drug addict is a simple standard...either you drank or you didn't. Either you used or you didn't. No debate, no discussion, very definitive, black and white, cut and dry. However, when we look at our sickness, our disease, where is the standard of sobriety. Is it an action? Perhaps. However, it is not as definitive as it is with the alcoholic or addict. Where are our slips? An action? Thinking? A text? An email? Comments? Arguing? Getting sucked into the drama, chaos, turmoil? Is it enabling? Not detaching? And so on.
I was at my usual Saturday morning meeting -- an incredible meeting -- and I was talking with one of the "double winners" (he is in both AA and al-anon), and during the course of the conversation, he said has been sober for 35 years. He's been in recovery the entire time. He has not had a drink, for 35 years. Then the conversation went to my ex-wife, who is an alcoholic and drug addict, and then onto an ex-GF, where the relationship was unhealthy, unacceptable behavior, tons of drama, chaos, turmoil, she has a heroin addict son, and so on. I then realized that in looking at my progress, my healthiness and well-being -- sobriety is something that is important. But, again, what is the standard.
At that moment, my friend asked me..."So how long have you been sober, from your disease, your sickness, your actions, thinking, behavior, and so on?" I looked at him, looked at the clock on my smartphone and said, "I am sober about 90 minutes." It wasn't a full blown episode. It was a minor slip. A quick, unhealthy thought, which ran for a few minutes. Stinking thinking. No big deal. I caught it, and got immediately back on track. I recovered. And I was on my way to a great meeting. However, in the equivalent of an alcoholic...I drank. My friend said, while he was sober and hadn't drank in 35 years, as it related to al-anon and his disease et al, he said that he was sober about 12 hours. We both laughed a bit, but it was an interesting conversation.
So, my emotional sobriety can mean a lot of different things in a lot of different scenarios and situations. My emotional sobriety starts and ends with emotional detachment. I have to be detached both emotionally and physically from certain people. Sometimes temporary, sometimes permanent. I cannot maintain a relationship, of any type with my ex-GF. It is not healthy. In the event of emergency or if it is related to our daughter (her biological daughter, and my step-daughter), we could text or perhaps even talk -- but the conversation is limited to our daughter. Her other child is a heroin addict. I've never had a relationship with him. I am not insensitive or not caring, but I never viewed him as my step-son. It's not what I wanted, but it is what developed and the fact is this is where we are. I have to detach from unhealthy people in my life -- because often, their drama, chaos and turmoil is the type, or the person, sucks me in. Tries to. I can't be. I can't allow that to happen. It is not healthy for me. It is like the addict or alcoholic who says "If I drink" or "If I use"..."I will die." I don't know if I will, but I can't go back there. It was my rock bottom. So, I have to detach. Emotional detachment is not easy when you are in it. All you do is think about the other person. It's what we do. It became our job. How could we not. Well, we know we can! And we do!
Emotional sobriety -- like emotional detachment -- is a state of mind, a way of thinking, a mindset. It is me thinking and behaving in a healthy way. A way that is healthy for me. It allows me to be a healthy -- and better -- person. A better brother, uncle, son, BF, business associate, and dad (to my daughter). While she is only 20, and her brother is 22, I have learned a great deal from both of them. Learn in a sense that I see how she wants to be healthy and happy, and enjoy all that life has to offer, and I see how she lives her life. And, I see him, who is sick and has a disease, doesn't want to get better, get clean and sober, get healthy, and I see how he lives his life.
What is emotional detachment and emotional sobriety to you? How do you emotionally detach? Not the "I go to a movie" perspective, although that certainly can work and be important. More the how do you stop the stinking thinking and unhealthy mind-racing, thinking tracks, etc. How do you protect, stay and maintain your emotional sobriety?
Thank you very much.
Aline said
Jun 26, 2017
Hi, Bo, you've brought up a great topic! Detachment and emotional sobriety is very much a center of my attention right now, as I'm finally, finally beginning to be able to detach in a way that is becoming more natural for me. I was previously, when I managed it, most often detaching intellectually, but it didn't feel "right" or natural, I just attempted to do my best with the tools provided in Alanon, which was a good start... I'm so very grateful this attitude is finally really sinking in. But I feel - and others have said so here on the board - that our recovery is unending journey, progress not perfection. I think its kind of like playing a musical instrument - one can't completely unlearn to play piano, but the skills definitely can and will become "rustier" the more time is spent not playing the piano anymore. That's how this feels to me at the moment, anyway. So, yeah, I'm really just starting to get the hang of this thing, but boy am I glad about that :)
KT2015 said
Jun 26, 2017
Hi Bo
Interesting topic and interesting questions to ponder.
What is emotional detachment and emotional sobriety? Hmmmmmmm. The al anon term I am most familiar with is loving detachment. Although I have heard a member here or there refer to emotional sobriety I haven't seen much or anything about it in the literature and so I don't really know what that would be. Loving detachment as I see it is me having more respect for others than to assume I know what is best for them. When I am in a good place with Loving detachment I am able to see them as a separate person from me with their own higher power. Even if I disagree with their choices or actions or words I can still respect them as someone who deserves the dignity to make their own decisions. When I practice loving detachment there is little to no judgement. I am releasing them to my Higher Power. Deep down I do believe that we all have to get where we are going in different ways. I have done things others didn't approve of but I've been given the dignity of making my own mistakes and I really want to do the same for others.
How do I lovingly detach? I have to go back to this regularly. I have found that this program has taught me a lot about self acceptance and self compassion and the more I practice that with myself the more I can feel that way towards others. If I can accept myself even with my mistakes and flaws it makes it easier to do the same with others. The quicker way to loving detachment is to practice the first three steps which I break down into "I can't (manage/control/ change this person)" "my HP Can" "I'll let Him". I use a God box, I have a conversation with my HP where I give the person over, I visualize handing the person over to my HP and then I try to focus on me. Often when I am focused on someone else it's a sign for me that I'm not taking care of myself. There is probably something in my life I'm not doing that needs doing while I spend time obsessed over something or someone else.
How do you protect, stay and maintain your loving detachment (the words I'm familiar with)? Practice, practice, practice. Whenever I fall of that horse I get back on as soon as I realize it. I find that I am getting better each time at identifying early if I am getting too wrapped up in someone else. I have regular practices to bring the focus back to me such as daily readings, weekly meetings, etc. I don't think it is possible to ever reach a point where I am completely detached because then I would probably be a robot lol. I use the slogan progress not perfection and I am kind to myself when I slip but I keep making the effort to do better.
Bo said
Jun 26, 2017
Aline wrote:
Hi, Bo, you've brought up a great topic! Detachment and emotional sobriety is very much a center of my attention right now, as I'm finally, finally beginning to be able to detach in a way that is becoming more natural for me. I was previously, when I managed it, most often detaching intellectually, but it didn't feel "right" or natural, I just attempted to do my best with the tools provided in Alanon, which was a good start... I'm so very grateful this attitude is finally really sinking in. But I feel - and others have said so here on the board - that our recovery is unending journey, progress not perfection. I think its kind of like playing a musical instrument - one can't completely unlearn to play piano, but the skills definitely can and will become "rustier" the more time is spent not playing the piano anymore. That's how this feels to me at the moment, anyway. So, yeah, I'm really just starting to get the hang of this thing, but boy am I glad about that :)
I hear you! LOL. Detachment for me was always difficult. Originally, it was impossible. A loved one was in trouble -- I had to do something! Detachment was impossible. I viewed it as ignoring, or abandoning the person and their plight. However, I learned that is NOT what it meant. It was coupled with enabling and me not perpetuating what was going on -- the arguing, the drama, the chaos, the turmoil, etc. -- and I learned that I did not have to be a partner in all of that. I did not have to contribute to it or play a role in it. The alcoholic/addict had to figure it out on their own -- yet I could be there for them in a healthy and supportive way, but not have to be so in it with them. This took time to learn. I could visit the addict in jail and be there for them, but not get involved in the minutia, him blaming the world for him being in jail, not being involved in the details of the case, the court proceedings, etc. I could support their efforts in getting clean and sober -- but if they weren't trying to do that, I could still be there, but not be involved with what they were doing and how they lived their life as they were still using. Hard to explain.
It didn't feel right to me -- but it became necessary -- for me to survive! I was going crazy. The alcoholic/addict had to hit rock bottom. If I was involve,d, if I softened the blow, if I bailed them out, literally or figuratively, if I contributed anything...then the addict/alcoholic HAD NO REASON TO CHANGE, and had no reason to want to get better, clean, sober, healthy.
I couldn't want it more than them. So, I had to detach -- for me! Not to punish them, but for me to be healthy. I had to be able to think clearly, and not be sucked into the duress, stress, emotional turmoil. Detachment meant I had to sit by and watch what was happening...and I had to STOP trying to do anything about it. I could be sad as it was sad to watch, but I had to not let that sadness consume me, ruin me, or change my role, which was to detach. I couldn't let the sadness overcome me and cause me to help, enable, get involved, etc.
Thanks for your comments.
Bo said
Jun 26, 2017
KT2015 wrote:
Hi Bo Interesting topic and interesting questions to ponder. What is emotional detachment and emotional sobriety? Hmmmmmmm. The al anon term I am most familiar with is loving detachment. Although I have heard a member here or there refer to emotional sobriety I haven't seen much or anything about it in the literature and so I don't really know what that would be. Loving detachment as I see it is me having more respect for others than to assume I know what is best for them. When I am in a good place with Loving detachment I am able to see them as a separate person from me with their own higher power. Even if I disagree with their choices or actions or words I can still respect them as someone who deserves the dignity to make their own decisions. When I practice loving detachment there is little to no judgement. I am releasing them to my Higher Power. Deep down I do believe that we all have to get where we are going in different ways. I have done things others didn't approve of but I've been given the dignity of making my own mistakes and I really want to do the same for others.
How do I lovingly detach? I have to go back to this regularly. I have found that this program has taught me a lot about self acceptance and self compassion and the more I practice that with myself the more I can feel that way towards others. If I can accept myself even with my mistakes and flaws it makes it easier to do the same with others. The quicker way to loving detachment is to practice the first three steps which I break down into "I can't (manage/control/ change this person)" "my HP Can" "I'll let Him". I use a God box, I have a conversation with my HP where I give the person over, I visualize handing the person over to my HP and then I try to focus on me. Often when I am focused on someone else it's a sign for me that I'm not taking care of myself. There is probably something in my life I'm not doing that needs doing while I spend time obsessed over something or someone else.
How do you protect, stay and maintain your loving detachment (the words I'm familiar with)? Practice, practice, practice. Whenever I fall of that horse I get back on as soon as I realize it. I find that I am getting better each time at identifying early if I am getting too wrapped up in someone else. I have regular practices to bring the focus back to me such as daily readings, weekly meetings, etc. I don't think it is possible to ever reach a point where I am completely detached because then I would probably be a robot lol. I use the slogan progress not perfection and I am kind to myself when I slip but I keep making the effort to do better.
There isn't a lot on emotional detachment. I think I read a few articles in The Forum. This is just my perspective on detachment -- two types, physical and emotional. Physical detachment for me was easy. But then...I couldn't stop my mind from thinking about her...all the time! I had to learn how to emotionally detach. Yes, I disagreed with the alcoholic -- their decisions, actions, how they were living their life, as well as the lies, stealing, etc. -- and while I didn't respect any of that, I let it go. I was sad about it, but not angry. I didn't let either consume me if either occurred. If anger, I let it go and got past it. If sadness, I didn't let it consume me.
I slip. I don't beat myself up. I get back on track ASAP. I do three things:
1) I go to meetings
2) I do readings in Courage to Change and One Day at a Time, every single day, every morning, and every evening.
3) I pick up the phone. I call my sponsor. I do the work. I call the person I am doing Blueprint for Progress with. I do the work.
I keep trying -- doing -- every day, to live my life in a healthy way. By maintaining my emotional sobriety, and my emotional detachment, perhaps from the stinking thinking, I can make healthy decisions. I can do what is healthy for me, and that allows me to be healthy and happy. Thanks.
Iamhere said
Jun 26, 2017
Hey Bo - great share - tons to ponder....for me, as a double winner, I personally define sobriety as sober and active in program. Sobriety is not just dry - it's also a mindset...way of life. Sure - in almost 30 years, there have been times when I was more 'dry' than sober but I define it a bit differently...
As far as Al-Anon, in my ever-trying effort to keep things simple, it's about serenity. Nothing more, nothing less. Even when there is chaos/drama around me, have I leaned into my program and kept my serenity? I have to keep it simple as when I overthink it, I tend to be hyper-critical of me.
A successful day is when I have put me first and done service for others....I've committed to my routine - prayer/readings in the morning, talk to program friend(s) throughout the day and prayer/readings at night time. Steps 1-2-3 in the AM and Steps 10-11 each evening. My HP is in charge, so I pray each morning for the strength to be sober, serenity, sane and of service. I end my day thankful/grateful for all my learning and my life.
I am after a daily reprieve only from my self-will and ego for both sides of the program. I do not consider a negative thought about a person, place, situation, event or thing as a slip - rather it's an event which I can loose my serenity over or accept as a lesson. Nothing more and nothing less. Progress vs. perfection is also a mention in my daily morning prayer as I was a type A black/white perfectionist when I arrived. I also was huge on advising, counseling, and fixing everything for everyone. I now focus more on listening and praying as my first step in being of service.
A good day for me is when I've not had a drink/drug and I've been able to keep my mouth closed and take the high road. A few smiles to strangers and the same to small children. No advice, no directions - no unsolicited input to others. Balance between rest, chores, work, fun. That's all I want today - my needs are met and my wants are very simple.
If I had to define emotional detachment I would qualify it simply as unconditional love. Loving and accepting others exactly as they are - imperfect people, just like me, doing the best they can with what they have.
Bo said
Jun 26, 2017
Iamhere wrote:
Hey Bo - great share - tons to ponder....for me, as a double winner, I personally define sobriety as sober and active in program. Sobriety is not just dry - it's also a mindset...way of life. Sure - in almost 30 years, there have been times when I was more 'dry' than sober but I define it a bit differently...
As far as Al-Anon, in my ever-trying effort to keep things simple, it's about serenity. Nothing more, nothing less. Even when there is chaos/drama around me, have I leaned into my program and kept my serenity? I have to keep it simple as when I overthink it, I tend to be hyper-critical of me.
A successful day is when I have put me first and done service for others....I've committed to my routine - prayer/readings in the morning, talk to program friend(s) throughout the day and prayer/readings at night time. Steps 1-2-3 in the AM and Steps 10-11 each evening. My HP is in charge, so I pray each morning for the strength to be sober, serenity, sane and of service. I end my day thankful/grateful for all my learning and my life.
I am after a daily reprieve only from my self-will and ego for both sides of the program. I do not consider a negative thought about a person, place, situation, event or thing as a slip - rather it's an event which I can loose my serenity over or accept as a lesson. Nothing more and nothing less. Progress vs. perfection is also a mention in my daily morning prayer as I was a type A black/white perfectionist when I arrived. I also was huge on advising, counseling, and fixing everything for everyone. I now focus more on listening and praying as my first step in being of service.
A good day for me is when I've not had a drink/drug and I've been able to keep my mouth closed and take the high road. A few smiles to strangers and the same to small children. No advice, no directions - no unsolicited input to others. Balance between rest, chores, work, fun. That's all I want today - my needs are met and my wants are very simple.
If I had to define emotional detachment I would qualify it simply as unconditional love. Loving and accepting others exactly as they are - imperfect people, just like me, doing the best they can with what they have.
I agree! 1000%. My serenity, which is coupled with my healthiness and well being -- that is what it's all about. Period. I've often said there could be a lot of drama, chaos and turmoil IN MY LIFE...or it can be AROUND MY LIFE...and when it is the latter, I am still happy and healthy. When it's the former, it has infiltrated my life, and it has infiltrated my well being, my healthy, my happiness. I cannot have that. So I do the work. Every single day.
Emotional detachment for me is when I am not thinking about the other person, not in an unhealthy way. I can wish them good things, pray for them, hope they find the desire to get better, healthy, etc., and I can hope they are OK. But I can't think about what they are doing, who they are with, allow myself to feel inferior, with no self-worth, or beat myself up for accepting unacceptable behavior. With my ex-GF, it used to be me thinking she is back together with her abusive, criminal, drug addict ex-BF. I used to feel if she was back with him -- then she never cared or loved me. She never thought what we had was special because she just went back to him. I would think about his name tattooed on her body. I would think about how she saved certain mementos from her time with him. But, today, I am healthy. I let all of that go -- I realized and know none of that had anything to do with me. She was and is unhealthy and she is emotionally incapable of being healthy, living a healthy life, and enjoying a healthy relationship with me. There's more, but that's why I ended the relationship with her. She moved away, which is even better for me. I don't think about her in unhealthy ways -- unhealthy for me. I am grateful I ended the relationship. It was the best thing, the right thing for me to do. And I am happy I did it.
I don't love her, don't feel love for her, but I wish good things for her. I wish her happiness and healthiness. I am healthy so I was able to let go of the anger and resentment that I had -- because of what she did to me. But I learned, she didn't do it to me -- she was just doing what she was doing. It was all she could do. I am OK with that. I didn't have to just forgive her -- I had to forgive me!
Thanks again.
maryjane said
Jun 26, 2017
Hi,
I have developed new habits. It took a long time to get back to the things that I like, but with a lot of determination, I have gone a long way. For example, I started taking long walks with the dog. At first I still thought about him, him, him on the walks. But then awareness of what I was doing kicked in and I knew I had to change that..... so I purposely had a list of "other things to think of" and I started to play music on the iphone. That changed that habit. Now, when I find I am thinking about him, I realize that it is brief and normal, not obsession.
I also read a lot more than I did back then. I read a lot when I was growing up but quit when I was obsessive about "him, him, him." I purposely looked for books that I loved and read them. I know where to go when I need a laugh or a crime drama or some history.... (Evanovich, Baldacci and Michener).
I also started to volunteer once a week for a couple of hours. It was nice to have that to look forward to.
Take care of yourself.
MissM said
Jun 27, 2017
To me, the "go to a movie" perspective is perfectly valid and works for me because if I find myself obsessing over another person then I need a "reset"- anything to break me out of the thought patterns and into a frame of mind where I can breath it away and get on with the next right thing. I am of a mind that I spent some 38 years of my life agonising over and trying to predict, rewrite and fix not only other people's thoughts and feelings but my own.
Al-anon worked for me because it gave me permission to just stop, hand all of that crap over to my HP and focus on here, now, and the next right thing.
Laughter is the one thing that can usually snap me out of the pain, or whatever it is that grips me so tightly when i slip into obsessing (over someone elses thinking OR over my own) so, for me, it's a funny book, or a comedian on youtube, or a conversation with someone who makes me laugh, or writing in a forum where everything is a joke, etc.
That's not to say that the emotions or situations don't need to be dealt with; sometimes they do but that's after I am feeling detached and able to be pragmatic. Actually detaching, for me, is basically throwing a stick to my inner puppy until it wags its tail lol
Bo said
Jun 27, 2017
MissM wrote:
To me, the "go to a movie" perspective is perfectly valid and works for me because if I find myself obsessing over another person then I need a "reset"- anything to break me out of the thought patterns and into a frame of mind where I can breath it away and get on with the next right thing. I am of a mind that I spent some 38 years of my life agonising over and trying to predict, rewrite and fix not only other people's thoughts and feelings but my own. Al-anon worked for me because it gave me permission to just stop, hand all of that crap over to my HP and focus on here, now, and the next right thing. Laughter is the one thing that can usually snap me out of the pain, or whatever it is that grips me so tightly when i slip into obsessing (over someone elses thinking OR over my own) so, for me, it's a funny book, or a comedian on youtube, or a conversation with someone who makes me laugh, or writing in a forum where everything is a joke, etc. That's not to say that the emotions or situations don't need to be dealt with; sometimes they do but that's after I am feeling detached and able to be pragmatic. Actually detaching, for me, is basically throwing a stick to my inner puppy until it wags its tail lol
That's great!!! Thank you so very much for your insight and perspective. I have done the comedian thing on youtube many times -- and it works! Just to get my laughing, and it breaks the pattern or track of my thinking. You are right -- it is a reset button. I like it. Thanks!
tiredtonite said
Jun 27, 2017
Thanks for the topic Bo. Whatever the topic, the slogan Let It Begin With Me is my go to slogan. This is a program of keeping the focus on myself, pointing the finger inward as opposed to outward, examining my own actions, thoughts, motives. When I came to Alanon, I was a rescuer of other people. It was a great device for seeing myself as the "healthy" one, taking the inventory of others and uh hemm helping them to become as "acceptable" as I believed I was. It was egotistical and condescending.
I was taught in Alanon that my serenity is proportionate to my acceptance. This is a great reminder that we're all perfectly human in our imperfection. We all have a right to be who we are, where we are. A power much much greater than myself is overseeing all lives. I don't need to fear how others will affect me, how I will affect them. I am being taken care of by a higher power so I don't need to fear for others. They are being taken care of by a higher power so they don't need to fear me.
In Alanon, I've learned ego can be an acronym for edging god out. As an Alanon, when I practice loving detachment, I try to be mindful to invite my higher power to guide me in each unique situation as it comes along. We are all individuals and I'd like to believe that at this point in my recovery I've learned to see each person at face value rather than imposing assumptions and labels such as alcoholic, unrecovering Alanon or well.. you name it. I'm a work in progress in this life and so are they.
It's essential to call upon my hp to steady my emotions and guide my words and actions. "Thy will, not my will be done." I'm less inclined to flee uncomfortable situations and people today. Admittedly, I am sometimes impatient (lacking in humility) at times when encountering dramatic and chaotic people and situations but they don't send me into panic mode like they had when I was earlier in Alanon. It's more like.. oh, ok higher power I know you'll help me to act vs. react if this is where you want me. Sometimes my higher power will let me know, nope no need for your help - step aside I've got a lesson for this person that doesn't involve you you just stay here and keep doing what you're doing until I let you know otherwise.
I guess this is what loving detachment looks like for me today as opposed to detaching with an axe which I practiced when I didn't have a solid relationship with a loving higher power. Detaching with an axe for me involved heart palpitations, sweating, lightheadedness, gulping and outright fleeing any person, place or thing that made me uncomfortable. I gave it so much power by way of overwhelming fear and that fear remained my higher power until I came, I came to, I came to believe that a "loving" higher power could restore me to sanity.
Each day, my goal is to be of good service to my loving hp, to put positive energy in this world not negative. I ask and my hp shows me what that looks like. For me, HOW honesty, openness, willingness is a good tool when communicating with that higher power and also with others. I can express to my hp honestly all my vulnerabilities and ask for help with emotional balance. I can find the courage to ask for clarity from others in their communication with me, be an active listener. I can ask hp's help in expressing myself clearly, honestly, respectfully, empathetically with others. I feel emotional safety when communicating this way. I can choose loving detachment concerning others when necessary after hearing them out. I've known the safety of my hp having my back and I trust it. I've asked for help, I've communicated my needs, wants, desires. I've given help, filled a need and fulfilled a desire for another when appropriate. I continue to trust my god to let me know what's next. TT
Bo said
Jun 27, 2017
I understand the loving detachment. It is not something I have mastered -- but I make progress. For me, early on detachment was not detach with love, but exclusively detach for survival! I had to. I was dying. But I made sure I was not ignoring, cold, punitive, etc. Then I graduated to detach with compassion and kindness. I ultimately got to detach with love, but it's not constant and always. However, when it's not there -- I am not angry or punitive. I simply detach period.
My ex-gf attacked me verbally in a recent exchange. While I should not have taken the call, she said it had to do with her daughter/my step-daughter. Anyway, she verbally assaulted me, and I finally said, I am not getting into this with you, and I ended the conversation and politely hung up the phone. I was frustrated, a bit angry, but I quickly let it go and realized this is who she is. She is emotionally and morally bankrupt -- and this is what she does.
It might take a few days -- and I won't have any anger or resentment -- but I will eventually return to being able to wish good things for her. She is not well and I wish her all the best.
mamalioness said
Jun 27, 2017
Iamhere wrote:
As far as Al-Anon, in my ever-trying effort to keep things simple, it's about serenity. Nothing more, nothing less. Even when there is chaos/drama around me, have I leaned into my program and kept my serenity? I have to keep it simple as when I overthink it, I tend to be hyper-critical of me.
A successful day is when I have put me first and done service for others....I've committed to my routine - prayer/readings in the morning, talk to program friend(s) throughout the day and prayer/readings at night time. Steps 1-2-3 in the AM and Steps 10-11 each evening. My HP is in charge, so I pray each morning for the strength to be sober, serenity, sane and of service. I end my day thankful/grateful for all my learning and my life.
I am after a daily reprieve only from my self-will and ego for both sides of the program. I do not consider a negative thought about a person, place, situation, event or thing as a slip - rather it's an event which I can loose my serenity over or accept as a lesson. Nothing more and nothing less. Progress vs. perfection is also a mention in my daily morning prayer as I was a type A black/white perfectionist when I arrived. I also was huge on advising, counseling, and fixing everything for everyone. I now focus more on listening and praying as my first step in being of service.
A good day for me is when I've not had a drink/drug and I've been able to keep my mouth closed and take the high road. A few smiles to strangers and the same to small children. No advice, no directions - no unsolicited input to others. Balance between rest, chores, work, fun. That's all I want today - my needs are met and my wants are very simple.
WOW! this is what i need to meditate on every day to keep ME emotionally sober....as one who suffers from GAD and C-PTSD, its difficult, but if I can be MINDFUL---IN the moment--IN my body, I can practice the other components that you describe...Bo: this is an awesome thread...Glad I saw it..I needed to read ALL shares here b/c I am working on emotional management (progress but will never be done) and also behavioral management/modification...with no funds for therapist, I am relying on program and its steps, slogans and also on line researching and I am trying to wean down not out but down on my medication which is low dose anyway because of all the self care I do, but I want to get where I can manage the symptoms with less meds and more program/management of me....the free floating fears I have, staying in the present--keeping it simple---not over thinking as you say...My mind can be my worst enemy...as one who grew up with extreme and long term child abuse, I literally stopped developing at around age 13-14 and i never felt any emotions there but anger and fear.....my goal is to "re-organized" my Ef'd up brain/thinking...I think I can do it if i cling tight to program and practicing better ways to respond to stress..............THANK you all for your great shares here...this is awesome place...Glad I came back.....Hugs to all
tiredtonite said
Jun 27, 2017
Bo,
Sounds like common sense self care to hang up the phone and not be verbally abused by your exgf. Setting healthy boundaries is important. TT
milkwood said
Jun 27, 2017
What an awesome thread, thank you Bo.
I have a mental image of a black hole (overthinking, anticipating et al) and I have to remind myself to step back if I feel myself getting sucked into thinking too much. As IAH says, mixing my day up with rest, chores, fun and work tends to keep me on an even keel. If the rest and fun are missing I become quite cranky!! If something happens that upsets me I go to another mental image which is full of safety and gentle love. When I think of this positive image I can feel my stomach and face relax so I know it works!
As I read all of these wonderful posts I was wondering if I have always had this obsessional thinking and I don't think that is the case for me - my thinking has certainly been changed by trying to live in, and solve, the unpredictable world of alcoholism. As you say Bo, forgiving myself for that is important.
Part of my emotional sobriety is trusting myself, knowing that I can take better care of myself now and that I don't need to be fearful of my future.
MissM - I love your image of the inner puppy wagging it's tail - thump, thump, thump!!! Thank you!!
Sobriety for the alcoholic or drug addict is a simple standard...either you drank or you didn't. Either you used or you didn't. No debate, no discussion, very definitive, black and white, cut and dry. However, when we look at our sickness, our disease, where is the standard of sobriety. Is it an action? Perhaps. However, it is not as definitive as it is with the alcoholic or addict. Where are our slips? An action? Thinking? A text? An email? Comments? Arguing? Getting sucked into the drama, chaos, turmoil? Is it enabling? Not detaching? And so on.
I was at my usual Saturday morning meeting -- an incredible meeting -- and I was talking with one of the "double winners" (he is in both AA and al-anon), and during the course of the conversation, he said has been sober for 35 years. He's been in recovery the entire time. He has not had a drink, for 35 years. Then the conversation went to my ex-wife, who is an alcoholic and drug addict, and then onto an ex-GF, where the relationship was unhealthy, unacceptable behavior, tons of drama, chaos, turmoil, she has a heroin addict son, and so on. I then realized that in looking at my progress, my healthiness and well-being -- sobriety is something that is important. But, again, what is the standard.
At that moment, my friend asked me..."So how long have you been sober, from your disease, your sickness, your actions, thinking, behavior, and so on?" I looked at him, looked at the clock on my smartphone and said, "I am sober about 90 minutes." It wasn't a full blown episode. It was a minor slip. A quick, unhealthy thought, which ran for a few minutes. Stinking thinking. No big deal. I caught it, and got immediately back on track. I recovered. And I was on my way to a great meeting. However, in the equivalent of an alcoholic...I drank. My friend said, while he was sober and hadn't drank in 35 years, as it related to al-anon and his disease et al, he said that he was sober about 12 hours. We both laughed a bit, but it was an interesting conversation.
So, my emotional sobriety can mean a lot of different things in a lot of different scenarios and situations. My emotional sobriety starts and ends with emotional detachment. I have to be detached both emotionally and physically from certain people. Sometimes temporary, sometimes permanent. I cannot maintain a relationship, of any type with my ex-GF. It is not healthy. In the event of emergency or if it is related to our daughter (her biological daughter, and my step-daughter), we could text or perhaps even talk -- but the conversation is limited to our daughter. Her other child is a heroin addict. I've never had a relationship with him. I am not insensitive or not caring, but I never viewed him as my step-son. It's not what I wanted, but it is what developed and the fact is this is where we are. I have to detach from unhealthy people in my life -- because often, their drama, chaos and turmoil is the type, or the person, sucks me in. Tries to. I can't be. I can't allow that to happen. It is not healthy for me. It is like the addict or alcoholic who says "If I drink" or "If I use"..."I will die." I don't know if I will, but I can't go back there. It was my rock bottom. So, I have to detach. Emotional detachment is not easy when you are in it. All you do is think about the other person. It's what we do. It became our job. How could we not. Well, we know we can! And we do!
Emotional sobriety -- like emotional detachment -- is a state of mind, a way of thinking, a mindset. It is me thinking and behaving in a healthy way. A way that is healthy for me. It allows me to be a healthy -- and better -- person. A better brother, uncle, son, BF, business associate, and dad (to my daughter). While she is only 20, and her brother is 22, I have learned a great deal from both of them. Learn in a sense that I see how she wants to be healthy and happy, and enjoy all that life has to offer, and I see how she lives her life. And, I see him, who is sick and has a disease, doesn't want to get better, get clean and sober, get healthy, and I see how he lives his life.
What is emotional detachment and emotional sobriety to you? How do you emotionally detach? Not the "I go to a movie" perspective, although that certainly can work and be important. More the how do you stop the stinking thinking and unhealthy mind-racing, thinking tracks, etc. How do you protect, stay and maintain your emotional sobriety?
Thank you very much.
Interesting topic and interesting questions to ponder.
What is emotional detachment and emotional sobriety? Hmmmmmmm. The al anon term I am most familiar with is loving detachment. Although I have heard a member here or there refer to emotional sobriety I haven't seen much or anything about it in the literature and so I don't really know what that would be. Loving detachment as I see it is me having more respect for others than to assume I know what is best for them. When I am in a good place with Loving detachment I am able to see them as a separate person from me with their own higher power. Even if I disagree with their choices or actions or words I can still respect them as someone who deserves the dignity to make their own decisions. When I practice loving detachment there is little to no judgement. I am releasing them to my Higher Power. Deep down I do believe that we all have to get where we are going in different ways. I have done things others didn't approve of but I've been given the dignity of making my own mistakes and I really want to do the same for others.
How do I lovingly detach? I have to go back to this regularly. I have found that this program has taught me a lot about self acceptance and self compassion and the more I practice that with myself the more I can feel that way towards others. If I can accept myself even with my mistakes and flaws it makes it easier to do the same with others. The quicker way to loving detachment is to practice the first three steps which I break down into "I can't (manage/control/ change this person)" "my HP Can" "I'll let Him". I use a God box, I have a conversation with my HP where I give the person over, I visualize handing the person over to my HP and then I try to focus on me. Often when I am focused on someone else it's a sign for me that I'm not taking care of myself. There is probably something in my life I'm not doing that needs doing while I spend time obsessed over something or someone else.
How do you protect, stay and maintain your loving detachment (the words I'm familiar with)? Practice, practice, practice. Whenever I fall of that horse I get back on as soon as I realize it. I find that I am getting better each time at identifying early if I am getting too wrapped up in someone else. I have regular practices to bring the focus back to me such as daily readings, weekly meetings, etc. I don't think it is possible to ever reach a point where I am completely detached because then I would probably be a robot lol. I use the slogan progress not perfection and I am kind to myself when I slip but I keep making the effort to do better.
I hear you! LOL. Detachment for me was always difficult. Originally, it was impossible. A loved one was in trouble -- I had to do something! Detachment was impossible. I viewed it as ignoring, or abandoning the person and their plight. However, I learned that is NOT what it meant. It was coupled with enabling and me not perpetuating what was going on -- the arguing, the drama, the chaos, the turmoil, etc. -- and I learned that I did not have to be a partner in all of that. I did not have to contribute to it or play a role in it. The alcoholic/addict had to figure it out on their own -- yet I could be there for them in a healthy and supportive way, but not have to be so in it with them. This took time to learn. I could visit the addict in jail and be there for them, but not get involved in the minutia, him blaming the world for him being in jail, not being involved in the details of the case, the court proceedings, etc. I could support their efforts in getting clean and sober -- but if they weren't trying to do that, I could still be there, but not be involved with what they were doing and how they lived their life as they were still using. Hard to explain.
It didn't feel right to me -- but it became necessary -- for me to survive! I was going crazy. The alcoholic/addict had to hit rock bottom. If I was involve,d, if I softened the blow, if I bailed them out, literally or figuratively, if I contributed anything...then the addict/alcoholic HAD NO REASON TO CHANGE, and had no reason to want to get better, clean, sober, healthy.
I couldn't want it more than them. So, I had to detach -- for me! Not to punish them, but for me to be healthy. I had to be able to think clearly, and not be sucked into the duress, stress, emotional turmoil. Detachment meant I had to sit by and watch what was happening...and I had to STOP trying to do anything about it. I could be sad as it was sad to watch, but I had to not let that sadness consume me, ruin me, or change my role, which was to detach. I couldn't let the sadness overcome me and cause me to help, enable, get involved, etc.
Thanks for your comments.
There isn't a lot on emotional detachment. I think I read a few articles in The Forum. This is just my perspective on detachment -- two types, physical and emotional. Physical detachment for me was easy. But then...I couldn't stop my mind from thinking about her...all the time! I had to learn how to emotionally detach. Yes, I disagreed with the alcoholic -- their decisions, actions, how they were living their life, as well as the lies, stealing, etc. -- and while I didn't respect any of that, I let it go. I was sad about it, but not angry. I didn't let either consume me if either occurred. If anger, I let it go and got past it. If sadness, I didn't let it consume me.
I slip. I don't beat myself up. I get back on track ASAP. I do three things:
1) I go to meetings
2) I do readings in Courage to Change and One Day at a Time, every single day, every morning, and every evening.
3) I pick up the phone. I call my sponsor. I do the work. I call the person I am doing Blueprint for Progress with. I do the work.
I keep trying -- doing -- every day, to live my life in a healthy way. By maintaining my emotional sobriety, and my emotional detachment, perhaps from the stinking thinking, I can make healthy decisions. I can do what is healthy for me, and that allows me to be healthy and happy. Thanks.
As far as Al-Anon, in my ever-trying effort to keep things simple, it's about serenity. Nothing more, nothing less. Even when there is chaos/drama around me, have I leaned into my program and kept my serenity? I have to keep it simple as when I overthink it, I tend to be hyper-critical of me.
A successful day is when I have put me first and done service for others....I've committed to my routine - prayer/readings in the morning, talk to program friend(s) throughout the day and prayer/readings at night time. Steps 1-2-3 in the AM and Steps 10-11 each evening. My HP is in charge, so I pray each morning for the strength to be sober, serenity, sane and of service. I end my day thankful/grateful for all my learning and my life.
I am after a daily reprieve only from my self-will and ego for both sides of the program. I do not consider a negative thought about a person, place, situation, event or thing as a slip - rather it's an event which I can loose my serenity over or accept as a lesson. Nothing more and nothing less. Progress vs. perfection is also a mention in my daily morning prayer as I was a type A black/white perfectionist when I arrived. I also was huge on advising, counseling, and fixing everything for everyone. I now focus more on listening and praying as my first step in being of service.
A good day for me is when I've not had a drink/drug and I've been able to keep my mouth closed and take the high road. A few smiles to strangers and the same to small children. No advice, no directions - no unsolicited input to others. Balance between rest, chores, work, fun. That's all I want today - my needs are met and my wants are very simple.
If I had to define emotional detachment I would qualify it simply as unconditional love. Loving and accepting others exactly as they are - imperfect people, just like me, doing the best they can with what they have.
I agree! 1000%. My serenity, which is coupled with my healthiness and well being -- that is what it's all about. Period. I've often said there could be a lot of drama, chaos and turmoil IN MY LIFE...or it can be AROUND MY LIFE...and when it is the latter, I am still happy and healthy. When it's the former, it has infiltrated my life, and it has infiltrated my well being, my healthy, my happiness. I cannot have that. So I do the work. Every single day.
Emotional detachment for me is when I am not thinking about the other person, not in an unhealthy way. I can wish them good things, pray for them, hope they find the desire to get better, healthy, etc., and I can hope they are OK. But I can't think about what they are doing, who they are with, allow myself to feel inferior, with no self-worth, or beat myself up for accepting unacceptable behavior. With my ex-GF, it used to be me thinking she is back together with her abusive, criminal, drug addict ex-BF. I used to feel if she was back with him -- then she never cared or loved me. She never thought what we had was special because she just went back to him. I would think about his name tattooed on her body. I would think about how she saved certain mementos from her time with him. But, today, I am healthy. I let all of that go -- I realized and know none of that had anything to do with me. She was and is unhealthy and she is emotionally incapable of being healthy, living a healthy life, and enjoying a healthy relationship with me. There's more, but that's why I ended the relationship with her. She moved away, which is even better for me. I don't think about her in unhealthy ways -- unhealthy for me. I am grateful I ended the relationship. It was the best thing, the right thing for me to do. And I am happy I did it.
I don't love her, don't feel love for her, but I wish good things for her. I wish her happiness and healthiness. I am healthy so I was able to let go of the anger and resentment that I had -- because of what she did to me. But I learned, she didn't do it to me -- she was just doing what she was doing. It was all she could do. I am OK with that. I didn't have to just forgive her -- I had to forgive me!
Thanks again.
I have developed new habits. It took a long time to get back to the things that I like, but with a lot of determination, I have gone a long way. For example, I started taking long walks with the dog. At first I still thought about him, him, him on the walks. But then awareness of what I was doing kicked in and I knew I had to change that..... so I purposely had a list of "other things to think of" and I started to play music on the iphone. That changed that habit. Now, when I find I am thinking about him, I realize that it is brief and normal, not obsession.
I also read a lot more than I did back then. I read a lot when I was growing up but quit when I was obsessive about "him, him, him." I purposely looked for books that I loved and read them. I know where to go when I need a laugh or a crime drama or some history.... (Evanovich, Baldacci and Michener).
I also started to volunteer once a week for a couple of hours. It was nice to have that to look forward to.
Take care of yourself.
Al-anon worked for me because it gave me permission to just stop, hand all of that crap over to my HP and focus on here, now, and the next right thing.
Laughter is the one thing that can usually snap me out of the pain, or whatever it is that grips me so tightly when i slip into obsessing (over someone elses thinking OR over my own) so, for me, it's a funny book, or a comedian on youtube, or a conversation with someone who makes me laugh, or writing in a forum where everything is a joke, etc.
That's not to say that the emotions or situations don't need to be dealt with; sometimes they do but that's after I am feeling detached and able to be pragmatic. Actually detaching, for me, is basically throwing a stick to my inner puppy until it wags its tail lol
That's great!!! Thank you so very much for your insight and perspective. I have done the comedian thing on youtube many times -- and it works! Just to get my laughing, and it breaks the pattern or track of my thinking. You are right -- it is a reset button. I like it. Thanks!
Thanks for the topic Bo. Whatever the topic, the slogan Let It Begin With Me is my go to slogan. This is a program of keeping the focus on myself, pointing the finger inward as opposed to outward, examining my own actions, thoughts, motives. When I came to Alanon, I was a rescuer of other people. It was a great device for seeing myself as the "healthy" one, taking the inventory of others and uh hemm helping them to become as "acceptable" as I believed I was. It was egotistical and condescending.
I was taught in Alanon that my serenity is proportionate to my acceptance. This is a great reminder that we're all perfectly human in our imperfection. We all have a right to be who we are, where we are. A power much much greater than myself is overseeing all lives. I don't need to fear how others will affect me, how I will affect them. I am being taken care of by a higher power so I don't need to fear for others. They are being taken care of by a higher power so they don't need to fear me.
In Alanon, I've learned ego can be an acronym for edging god out. As an Alanon, when I practice loving detachment, I try to be mindful to invite my higher power to guide me in each unique situation as it comes along. We are all individuals and I'd like to believe that at this point in my recovery I've learned to see each person at face value rather than imposing assumptions and labels such as alcoholic, unrecovering Alanon or well.. you name it. I'm a work in progress in this life and so are they.
It's essential to call upon my hp to steady my emotions and guide my words and actions. "Thy will, not my will be done." I'm less inclined to flee uncomfortable situations and people today. Admittedly, I am sometimes impatient (lacking in humility) at times when encountering dramatic and chaotic people and situations but they don't send me into panic mode like they had when I was earlier in Alanon. It's more like.. oh, ok higher power I know you'll help me to act vs. react if this is where you want me. Sometimes my higher power will let me know, nope no need for your help - step aside I've got a lesson for this person that doesn't involve you you just stay here and keep doing what you're doing until I let you know otherwise.
I guess this is what loving detachment looks like for me today as opposed to detaching with an axe which I practiced when I didn't have a solid relationship with a loving higher power. Detaching with an axe for me involved heart palpitations, sweating, lightheadedness, gulping and outright fleeing any person, place or thing that made me uncomfortable. I gave it so much power by way of overwhelming fear and that fear remained my higher power until I came, I came to, I came to believe that a "loving" higher power could restore me to sanity.
Each day, my goal is to be of good service to my loving hp, to put positive energy in this world not negative. I ask and my hp shows me what that looks like. For me, HOW honesty, openness, willingness is a good tool when communicating with that higher power and also with others. I can express to my hp honestly all my vulnerabilities and ask for help with emotional balance. I can find the courage to ask for clarity from others in their communication with me, be an active listener. I can ask hp's help in expressing myself clearly, honestly, respectfully, empathetically with others. I feel emotional safety when communicating this way. I can choose loving detachment concerning others when necessary after hearing them out. I've known the safety of my hp having my back and I trust it. I've asked for help, I've communicated my needs, wants, desires. I've given help, filled a need and fulfilled a desire for another when appropriate. I continue to trust my god to let me know what's next. TT
My ex-gf attacked me verbally in a recent exchange. While I should not have taken the call, she said it had to do with her daughter/my step-daughter. Anyway, she verbally assaulted me, and I finally said, I am not getting into this with you, and I ended the conversation and politely hung up the phone. I was frustrated, a bit angry, but I quickly let it go and realized this is who she is. She is emotionally and morally bankrupt -- and this is what she does.
It might take a few days -- and I won't have any anger or resentment -- but I will eventually return to being able to wish good things for her. She is not well and I wish her all the best.
WOW! this is what i need to meditate on every day to keep ME emotionally sober....as one who suffers from GAD and C-PTSD, its difficult, but if I can be MINDFUL---IN the moment--IN my body, I can practice the other components that you describe...Bo: this is an awesome thread...Glad I saw it..I needed to read ALL shares here b/c I am working on emotional management (progress but will never be done) and also behavioral management/modification...with no funds for therapist, I am relying on program and its steps, slogans and also on line researching and I am trying to wean down not out but down on my medication which is low dose anyway because of all the self care I do, but I want to get where I can manage the symptoms with less meds and more program/management of me....the free floating fears I have, staying in the present--keeping it simple---not over thinking as you say...My mind can be my worst enemy...as one who grew up with extreme and long term child abuse, I literally stopped developing at around age 13-14 and i never felt any emotions there but anger and fear.....my goal is to "re-organized" my Ef'd up brain/thinking...I think I can do it if i cling tight to program and practicing better ways to respond to stress..............THANK you all for your great shares here...this is awesome place...Glad I came back.....Hugs to all
Bo,
Sounds like common sense self care to hang up the phone and not be verbally abused by your exgf. Setting healthy boundaries is important. TT
I have a mental image of a black hole (overthinking, anticipating et al) and I have to remind myself to step back if I feel myself getting sucked into thinking too much. As IAH says, mixing my day up with rest, chores, fun and work tends to keep me on an even keel. If the rest and fun are missing I become quite cranky!! If something happens that upsets me I go to another mental image which is full of safety and gentle love. When I think of this positive image I can feel my stomach and face relax so I know it works!
As I read all of these wonderful posts I was wondering if I have always had this obsessional thinking and I don't think that is the case for me - my thinking has certainly been changed by trying to live in, and solve, the unpredictable world of alcoholism. As you say Bo, forgiving myself for that is important.
Part of my emotional sobriety is trusting myself, knowing that I can take better care of myself now and that I don't need to be fearful of my future.
MissM - I love your image of the inner puppy wagging it's tail - thump, thump, thump!!! Thank you!!