Learning so many hard new lessons since finding out about my wife's alcoholism. I'll observe some trait that she exhibits and now I wonder if that's part of the disease or is it just one of those personality things that we all have..... For instance she has a difficult time making friends. If I'm trying to include her in a social situation she has a hard time with it. Very shy and insecure. But once she opens up she makes friends and has a nice time. I just always thought she was shy. But now I think that may be part of this bigger picture....This is just an example. There are other habits that have taken their toll over the years.
My real question is, Does it help me to think about this? It seems like it might be helpful to have a better understanding but also that I'm focusing on her and her issues rather than myself. I don't want to assume every annoying or hurtful thing is a result of the disease. Or does it even matter.
shrnp said
May 31, 2017
Many people have social disorders that make talking to people easier when they drink alcohol. It is not uncommon for people to change habits when they stop drinking. I am in recovery and I do not participate in certain gatherings that I use to. I really don't like to be around people that get drunk. I am not worried about wanting to drink, I just would rather have different friends now.
hotrod said
May 31, 2017
Hi WestMan, you are a loving, concerned, partner and still seeking to understand the confusing disease of alcoholism. The disease has lead many of us on a merry chase and is described as cunning and baffling because alcoholism is a threefold disease, physical, mental and emotional. Once the drinking stops,this addresses the physical component the mental and emotional portion of the disease must be addressed in order for someone to be truly sober and living in constructive life.
Since we are powerless over people places and things, it is impossible to know why people say and do what they do. Alanon turns our attention back to ourselves and suggests tht we look to see why we have placed our focus on others because we can look at our own actions and improve only ourselves I too disliked large gatherings and mixing with strangers. Attending Al-Anon enabled me to learn how to keep the focus on myself, speak using the word" I" word and eliminate negative. destructive attitudes. These changes improved my interactions with the world and so my self-esteem was restored and my self worth expanded as the result. Encouraging your partner to see her positive attributes, treating her with courtesy and respect without having to analyze her would enrich your life.
By the way, in another post you spoke about attending Al-Anon meetings and having a difficult time sharing. I attended Al-Anon for over year before I said more than my name at meetings. I listened, read the literature, kept an open mind and kept coming back. Today I can share my experience, strength and hope with others. Just remember it's all a process
Positive thoughts and prayers on the way.
.
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Freetime said
May 31, 2017
I think it's normal to start wondering about all of these causes and complexities when we first realize that alcoholism is in the picture. I certainly did. How much is hereditary? How much is environment? How much is their choice vs. their powerlessness? Those times he behaved erratically ... was it the alcohol or his basic personality or a choice? But in the end, even if I can answer these questions, all of these are things I have no control over. And if they are hurting me, I have a responsibility to take care of myself.
You've recognized that right now you are focusing on her issues rather than yourself. Great insight and perfectly normal ... that's why we have this program to help us gradually change our focus.
In my experience, learning about the disease was enlightening and helpful. There is literature from AA and from other sources that talks about the spiritual and scientific bases of the disease, and once I was out of crisis mode, I read everything I could get my hands on about it. It was a part of my recovery to do that, and helped me understand Step 1 -- I am powerless over alcoholism. From there, I can begin my own recovery. Things began to shift when I really embraced that I needed and deserved to recover myself.
WestMan said
May 31, 2017
Freetime I think you gave the answer I was sort of poking at from afar. I think I need to stop wondering so much about how she acts and how these things do or don't fit in to the disease. As you said even if I did know there's nothing I can do to change her. Maybe just need to keep it in the back of my mind when things get bad that it's not necessarily the person I'm dealing with and to move on to worrying about myself.
SerenityRUS said
Jun 1, 2017
WestMan .. have you had a chance to read through the book Getting Them Sober? There are a few in the series .. think of it as alanon boot camp in terms of information .. I find I don't read them once. They are easy to read, short (less than 150-200pages) and good in a crunch .. they are not alanon lit .. however should be. Toby Rice Drew (Toby Drew Rice) she's a double winner and really has it going on ... do not let the title fool you it's about the Alanon side of the program. It has helped me a great deal in breaking things down .. I know I am very logical minded so if something doesn't make sense .. I need to break it down for me .. not about them .. it's about me. Why does my XAH do what he does? He's an alcoholic .. I am more prepared to accept that statement and not try to take things apart because now after all these years it makes sense to me.
Keep coming back .. hugs S :)
Iamhere said
Jun 1, 2017
Westman - I know that I drove myself crazy trying to determine what came first - social anxiety or the disease in my boys.....I see clearly (biased as a mom) that they were well-adjusted until they began using. They see themselves as socially awkward and the using eased their anxiety. We sit in one home with the same experiences, yet tell very different stories....it is what it is.
They and the program has taught me that no matter how much I love them or care for them, trying to assess what happened, what is, etc. is not productive for any of us. It is really hard to love someone and watch them struggle - with this disease or another - yet what I have discovered in Al-Anon is I am to avoid fixing others, yet try to be of maximum value to those I encounter.
When they appear to be stuck/struggling/anxious, my sponsor allows me one statement - How can I be of service or Can I be of service? That's about it. Beyond that, I am allowed to show empathy - I am sorry you are sad, hurting, anxious, angry...I can get so wrapped up in their stuff so quickly if/when I venture beyond these simple concepts....it's not even funny!!
My life does goes better when I can keep my focus on me....(((Hugs)))
Mattie said
Jun 1, 2017
It might also be helpful to remember that if something IS caused by the disease, that doesn't mean that if she stops drinking, the thing will go away. She and the disease have developed together, so what you see is who she is right now. If she successfully stops drinking (of course a big if), she would have to figure out life without the crutch of alcohol, which would lead her through a lot of changes and adaptations. Some people in recovery never mature much beyond their alcoholic selves, some go far. Really the kind of thing you're thinking about is a big "What if...?" question - what would she be like without the alcohol? It's like saying what would we be like if we had different parents, if we grew up in a foreign country, if we had or didn't have a disability, ten thousand different ways we might have been. What would you be like if you had never met your wife? That one might be a little bit more knowable for you because it's about you.
Wednesday said
Jun 4, 2017
I very much relate to what you are feeling Westman. I guess we are looking to blame all the negatives on "the disease". There is no way to tell what this person is really like without alcohol as a major component. That is so frustrating. Trying to get out of your own head and stop playing "what if" is so difficult. The healing of self is the only thing we have to offer.
SerenityRUS said
Jun 5, 2017
One thing I have consistently heard in Open Meetings around the table is that the drinking is only the tip of the iceberg .. once the physical sobriety is dealt with there is a whole other level that is to be dealt with .. thankfully I only have to deal with my stuff one day at a time. I do not envy the R/A who then has to deal with the years of drinking their issues away.
Honestly in reflection of this post it goes back to .. It doesn't matter what the A is doing sober or active THEY are still responsible for their actions the same way I am still responsible for mine .. it makes things easier to keep the focus on me and let them sort out their stuff. The question becomes do I want to stick around and unpack their train wreck or would I rather deal with my stuff. Personally for me my XAH did not want to unpack .. and I didn't want to continue the dysfunctional dance with him.
Hi WestMan, you are a loving, concerned, partner and still seeking to understand the confusing disease of alcoholism. The disease has lead many of us on a merry chase and is described as cunning and baffling because alcoholism is a threefold disease, physical, mental and emotional. Once the drinking stops,this addresses the physical component the mental and emotional portion of the disease must be addressed in order for someone to be truly sober and living in constructive life.
Since we are powerless over people places and things, it is impossible to know why people say and do what they do. Alanon turns our attention back to ourselves and suggests tht we look to see why we have placed our focus on others because we can look at our own actions and improve only ourselves
I too disliked large gatherings and mixing with strangers. Attending Al-Anon enabled me to learn how to keep the focus on myself, speak using the word" I" word and eliminate negative. destructive attitudes. These changes improved my interactions with the world and so my self-esteem was restored and my self worth expanded as the result.
Encouraging your partner to see her positive attributes, treating her with courtesy and respect without having to analyze her would enrich your life.
By the way, in another post you spoke about attending Al-Anon meetings and having a difficult time sharing. I attended Al-Anon for over year before I said more than my name at meetings. I listened, read the literature, kept an open mind and kept coming back. Today I can share my experience, strength and hope with others. Just remember it's all a process
Positive thoughts and prayers on the way.
.
-
--
You've recognized that right now you are focusing on her issues rather than yourself. Great insight and perfectly normal ... that's why we have this program to help us gradually change our focus.
In my experience, learning about the disease was enlightening and helpful. There is literature from AA and from other sources that talks about the spiritual and scientific bases of the disease, and once I was out of crisis mode, I read everything I could get my hands on about it. It was a part of my recovery to do that, and helped me understand Step 1 -- I am powerless over alcoholism. From there, I can begin my own recovery. Things began to shift when I really embraced that I needed and deserved to recover myself.
Keep coming back .. hugs S :)
They and the program has taught me that no matter how much I love them or care for them, trying to assess what happened, what is, etc. is not productive for any of us. It is really hard to love someone and watch them struggle - with this disease or another - yet what I have discovered in Al-Anon is I am to avoid fixing others, yet try to be of maximum value to those I encounter.
When they appear to be stuck/struggling/anxious, my sponsor allows me one statement - How can I be of service or Can I be of service? That's about it. Beyond that, I am allowed to show empathy - I am sorry you are sad, hurting, anxious, angry...I can get so wrapped up in their stuff so quickly if/when I venture beyond these simple concepts....it's not even funny!!
My life does goes better when I can keep my focus on me....(((Hugs)))
It might also be helpful to remember that if something IS caused by the disease, that doesn't mean that if she stops drinking, the thing will go away. She and the disease have developed together, so what you see is who she is right now. If she successfully stops drinking (of course a big if), she would have to figure out life without the crutch of alcohol, which would lead her through a lot of changes and adaptations. Some people in recovery never mature much beyond their alcoholic selves, some go far. Really the kind of thing you're thinking about is a big "What if...?" question - what would she be like without the alcohol? It's like saying what would we be like if we had different parents, if we grew up in a foreign country, if we had or didn't have a disability, ten thousand different ways we might have been. What would you be like if you had never met your wife? That one might be a little bit more knowable for you because it's about you.
Honestly in reflection of this post it goes back to .. It doesn't matter what the A is doing sober or active THEY are still responsible for their actions the same way I am still responsible for mine .. it makes things easier to keep the focus on me and let them sort out their stuff. The question becomes do I want to stick around and unpack their train wreck or would I rather deal with my stuff. Personally for me my XAH did not want to unpack .. and I didn't want to continue the dysfunctional dance with him.
Hugs S :)