I just want to kick myself. So many of you advised me not to tell him what I had found out here, but the past few days were killing me and I just couldn't sleep without getting it off my chest.
The last 3 nights have been horrible. He has drank to the point of staggering and slurring and snoring so loud, we can't sleep together. I asked him if he knew what the root was to our problems. He said he had no idea. I then asked what was the one thing he would never give up. He was quiet for a while, so I then asked him what was the one thing, if asked tomorrow to give it up, that he would have a definite NO for. He was quiet a little bit longer and then said "drinking". As soon as he said that I felt so calm because it gave me that one little sliver of hope, that if he acknowledged it, our lives would have a chance at getting better.
He then asked me why I was bringing this up at Christmas, so I told him that it was killing me to keep what I had been doing a secret from him. That I was reading a lot of material, going to online meetings and talking to others in the same situation. I explained that I choose to stay and in order to stay, I have a path that I need to follow in order to be happy, for us to be happy and that he has his path.
That was it, he was done talking or listening. To make a long story short, after 2 hours of agitation and ranting(from him), I went from having that sliver of hope to being in an even deeper hole. How could I make such a dumb choice?
MissM said
Dec 25, 2016
It was only a bad choice if you consider his "reaction" to be the only important measure.
You said the words for a reason....what was your motivation? Did you feel you needed to get it out in the open? If so then his reaction doesn't matter (it will pass). If you did it because you were expecting some kind of response from him, then you just gave yourself a really great opportunity to learn and grow. Either way, it's a win and you can take away something important from it!
Don't beat yourself up. Instead, you can choose to find the lesson, benefit from it and move forward!
You can only change you and it's good that you feel so positive about starting to find your own path. That's a yay in my book!
maryjane said
Dec 25, 2016
Exactly, MissM. My first idea was that "you had to touch the stove to see if it was hot!" Yes, it is hot. And it will be hot the next time you have to touch it too.
Don't beat yourself up over this. You were looking at his reaction. Look at your motivation instead. Get the focus on YOU.
Freetime said
Dec 25, 2016
Jage, it sounds to me like you said what you meant, meant what you said, and didn't say it meanly. That's good Al-Anon, even if the outcome wasn't what you hoped. There was a moment of clarity where you both saw the same truth. The outcome would have been the same whether it was Christmas or not.
I totally understand the discomfort (agony/pain) of being stuck in the house with an alcoholic. I understand having to find another place to sleep. I understand the anger that comes from the shame both people are feeling. I've been there.
Give yourself a big hug for "reading a lot of material, going to online meetings and talking to others in the same situation." It sounds to me like you are taking care of yourself, even though there is some discomfort along the way. We change the things we can, accept what we cannot change, and keep trying to know the difference.
Jerry F said
Dec 25, 2016
I am on my way to the morning meeting....Merry Christmas MIP Family....Jage I read your post and heard my sponsors reaction when I would do the same thing and then complain about it..."There you got yourself good that time". When I knew the disease in my life and marriage and knew how it worked and then again tried one more time to get it my way by poking at it expecting different results. I would get myself good. The consequence you got was as a result of what you did and I learned first to follow thru with what the program was teaching me....literature, sponsor, meetings, practice, practice, practice. I feel sad with you about this and pray it will get better. (((((hugs)))))
Enigmatic said
Dec 25, 2016
Hi Jage, welcome back...
Please, take it easier on yourself; you did what just about everyone before you here has done at least a few times...you tried what you know, thinking/hoping it might finally be the time that gets through to someone you love who drinks.
Recovery is about progress, not perfection. It starts with learning that there is a healthier way, a better way, and the tools we can adopt that make it possible. Then comes practice, as we try using the new tools, often unsuccessfully at first. Next, as we do experience the peace that comes from using the wisdom of the program over our own, we rely on them more.
Even when we get to the point where we are more likely to use program tools, we still fall back to old ways at times, but that's ok; we're human. Recovery is a process that we participate in our entire lives as we grow. As Jerry noted, you are doing the best thing you can do for you: reading, reaching out for a healthier place, breaking the pain of isolation.
Don't linger on the setbacks, learn from them...Noting how the wisdom of the program guided me in healthy directions compared with the unhealthy and unhappy direction mine took, helped me develop trust and confidence over time. In this way, every lesson was a good lesson...
Hang in there and keep coming back
Iamhere said
Dec 25, 2016
I may be way off base, but can only share my experience. I was raised to be honest, forthright and communicative. Especially in my marriage/relationships. When I withheld information, it made me feel deceptive. I had a hard time feeling deceptive. I too shared more than necessary at times, and also got reactions that were hurtful and unexpected.
With the program and a good sponsor, I learned that there is a difference between oversharing (me) and sharing (goal for me). If I wanted/needed to go to a meeting, I began just saying that I have plans on XXXXday. If they asked what, I would just say a support group. If they pushed, I stated the name openly. I did not share more or less than that - they know how to google if they want to understand, study, learn, etc. All this came about as a result of working the steps, realizing that healthy people practice self-care and in my life, oversharing just set me up again and again for conflict.
I had to also learn that no matter how reasonable, sane or practical my words are, good communication depends upon many elements. When this disease is active, you can be very certain that there will be filters applied as well as warped listening skills. It's the nature of the beast. This is why I was retrained to say less vs. overshare. I was amazed that most of our disagreements fizzled very quickly if I just answered the questions necessary and ignored the disease (ranting, raving, repeating, chaos, drama, etc.).
You did nothing wrong; you tested the waters and found discomfort. These situations are exactly what helps us change and learn. We are about progress and not perfection. It does get better and better when we can align with program suggestions. When we go off-track, the great news is we can get back upright using the same tools/resources. But without risks, it's hard to know if we are growing/changing. (((Hugs))) - sending you positive thoughts and prayers for peace!
Enigmatic said
Dec 25, 2016
Some great points, IAH; as I rethought how my comment might come across, I wish to add a possible clarification to my earlier comment.
I was drawing from the lesson on the subtleties of control found on Courage to Change p. 29. I found that I often spoke to my qualifier with expectations about what I hoped might happen after, or as a result of what I said. When did not get the response I was looking for, I felt frustrated.
In two situations, I might say the same exact words, but the intent is where I can go astray. If it is something that I feel I must say for myself, bravo. If it is something I say with the hope of a specific outcome, that is when I was most likely to feel regret. It is a subtle difference, but a powerful one.
All are lessons, and lessons learned yield insight. With the guidance of the program, this insight can take us along way in recovery
Jage1991 said
Dec 25, 2016
Thank you everyone. Your responses, however varied, each help in some way. Freetime, that moment of clarity that he and I both had, will help me for a long time. I honestly don't think that either of us will forget that even though it may lead no where. I do wish it hadn't spiralled but it did and I will most definitely learn from it. I really want to stay in this marriage but I'm scared that one day I may have no choice but to leave. But until then I will keep attending online meetings and pray that I can attend f2f meetings one day in my little town, read all the suggestions I have been given and keep on my path and let him have his. Hope you all had a good Christmas Day.
slogan_jim said
Dec 27, 2016
Hi Jage,
There is a saying I heard the other day. The best thing to happen in your life was the worst thing to happen to your life at the time. You regret telling him you are in recovery, but someday you'll be glad it's out there in the open. I feel this shines light, no matter how small, on the fact that something isn't right.
Based on how you told the story above, it doesn't sound like he thinks he has a problem at all. The constant pauses...suddenly blurting out drinking as the one thing he wouldn't give. He was searching for the answer you wanted to hear so you'd get off his back. Getting upset at your recovery sounds like further proof of that. I know we all want to believe, but please don't torture yourself by hanging on to someone's empty promises and manipulation.
All the best in your recovery :)
milkwood said
Dec 28, 2016
Why are you kicking yourself? I don't see anything wrong in what you've said or done - in fact I really like the way that you broached the subject. Now you both have a bit more knowledge.
Shame about the two hour rant, that sounds just like the noise my husband's gremlins used to make when they got indigestion as they chewed on the truth! We can learn new ways of dealing with those pesky monsters - or perhaps I should say 'ways of not dealing with them' instead. A few years ago I thought that I was supposed to feel uncomfortable when there was a rant. It was such a relief when I learnt that I didn't have to stick around, smooth things over or join in!! I didn't have to feel bad just because my husband chose to make a meal of it! . ((((hugs))))
-- Edited by milkwood on Wednesday 28th of December 2016 11:09:17 AM
I just want to kick myself. So many of you advised me not to tell him what I had found out here, but the past few days were killing me and I just couldn't sleep without getting it off my chest.
The last 3 nights have been horrible. He has drank to the point of staggering and slurring and snoring so loud, we can't sleep together. I asked him if he knew what the root was to our problems. He said he had no idea. I then asked what was the one thing he would never give up. He was quiet for a while, so I then asked him what was the one thing, if asked tomorrow to give it up, that he would have a definite NO for. He was quiet a little bit longer and then said "drinking". As soon as he said that I felt so calm because it gave me that one little sliver of hope, that if he acknowledged it, our lives would have a chance at getting better.
He then asked me why I was bringing this up at Christmas, so I told him that it was killing me to keep what I had been doing a secret from him. That I was reading a lot of material, going to online meetings and talking to others in the same situation. I explained that I choose to stay and in order to stay, I have a path that I need to follow in order to be happy, for us to be happy and that he has his path.
That was it, he was done talking or listening. To make a long story short, after 2 hours of agitation and ranting(from him), I went from having that sliver of hope to being in an even deeper hole. How could I make such a dumb choice?
You said the words for a reason....what was your motivation? Did you feel you needed to get it out in the open? If so then his reaction doesn't matter (it will pass). If you did it because you were expecting some kind of response from him, then you just gave yourself a really great opportunity to learn and grow. Either way, it's a win and you can take away something important from it!
Don't beat yourself up. Instead, you can choose to find the lesson, benefit from it and move forward!
You can only change you and it's good that you feel so positive about starting to find your own path. That's a yay in my book!
Don't beat yourself up over this. You were looking at his reaction. Look at your motivation instead. Get the focus on YOU.
Jage, it sounds to me like you said what you meant, meant what you said, and didn't say it meanly. That's good Al-Anon, even if the outcome wasn't what you hoped. There was a moment of clarity where you both saw the same truth. The outcome would have been the same whether it was Christmas or not.
I totally understand the discomfort (agony/pain) of being stuck in the house with an alcoholic. I understand having to find another place to sleep. I understand the anger that comes from the shame both people are feeling. I've been there.
Give yourself a big hug for "reading a lot of material, going to online meetings and talking to others in the same situation." It sounds to me like you are taking care of yourself, even though there is some discomfort along the way. We change the things we can, accept what we cannot change, and keep trying to know the difference.
I am on my way to the morning meeting....Merry Christmas MIP Family....Jage I read your post and heard my sponsors reaction when I would do the same thing and then complain about it..."There you got yourself good that time". When I knew the disease in my life and marriage and knew how it worked and then again tried one more time to get it my way by poking at it expecting different results. I would get myself good. The consequence you got was as a result of what you did and I learned first to follow thru with what the program was teaching me....literature, sponsor, meetings, practice, practice, practice. I feel sad with you about this and pray it will get better. (((((hugs)))))
Please, take it easier on yourself; you did what just about everyone before you here has done at least a few times...you tried what you know, thinking/hoping it might finally be the time that gets through to someone you love who drinks.
Recovery is about progress, not perfection. It starts with learning that there is a healthier way, a better way, and the tools we can adopt that make it possible. Then comes practice, as we try using the new tools, often unsuccessfully at first. Next, as we do experience the peace that comes from using the wisdom of the program over our own, we rely on them more.
Even when we get to the point where we are more likely to use program tools, we still fall back to old ways at times, but that's ok; we're human. Recovery is a process that we participate in our entire lives as we grow. As Jerry noted, you are doing the best thing you can do for you: reading, reaching out for a healthier place, breaking the pain of isolation.
Don't linger on the setbacks, learn from them...Noting how the wisdom of the program guided me in healthy directions compared with the unhealthy and unhappy direction mine took, helped me develop trust and confidence over time. In this way, every lesson was a good lesson...
Hang in there and keep coming back
With the program and a good sponsor, I learned that there is a difference between oversharing (me) and sharing (goal for me). If I wanted/needed to go to a meeting, I began just saying that I have plans on XXXXday. If they asked what, I would just say a support group. If they pushed, I stated the name openly. I did not share more or less than that - they know how to google if they want to understand, study, learn, etc. All this came about as a result of working the steps, realizing that healthy people practice self-care and in my life, oversharing just set me up again and again for conflict.
I had to also learn that no matter how reasonable, sane or practical my words are, good communication depends upon many elements. When this disease is active, you can be very certain that there will be filters applied as well as warped listening skills. It's the nature of the beast. This is why I was retrained to say less vs. overshare. I was amazed that most of our disagreements fizzled very quickly if I just answered the questions necessary and ignored the disease (ranting, raving, repeating, chaos, drama, etc.).
You did nothing wrong; you tested the waters and found discomfort. These situations are exactly what helps us change and learn. We are about progress and not perfection. It does get better and better when we can align with program suggestions. When we go off-track, the great news is we can get back upright using the same tools/resources. But without risks, it's hard to know if we are growing/changing. (((Hugs))) - sending you positive thoughts and prayers for peace!
I was drawing from the lesson on the subtleties of control found on Courage to Change p. 29. I found that I often spoke to my qualifier with expectations about what I hoped might happen after, or as a result of what I said. When did not get the response I was looking for, I felt frustrated.
In two situations, I might say the same exact words, but the intent is where I can go astray. If it is something that I feel I must say for myself, bravo. If it is something I say with the hope of a specific outcome, that is when I was most likely to feel regret. It is a subtle difference, but a powerful one.
All are lessons, and lessons learned yield insight. With the guidance of the program, this insight can take us along way in recovery
There is a saying I heard the other day. The best thing to happen in your life was the worst thing to happen to your life at the time. You regret telling him you are in recovery, but someday you'll be glad it's out there in the open. I feel this shines light, no matter how small, on the fact that something isn't right.
Based on how you told the story above, it doesn't sound like he thinks he has a problem at all. The constant pauses...suddenly blurting out drinking as the one thing he wouldn't give. He was searching for the answer you wanted to hear so you'd get off his back. Getting upset at your recovery sounds like further proof of that. I know we all want to believe, but please don't torture yourself by hanging on to someone's empty promises and manipulation.
All the best in your recovery :)
Why are you kicking yourself? I don't see anything wrong in what you've said or done - in fact I really like the way that you broached the subject. Now you both have a bit more knowledge.
A few years ago I thought that I was supposed to feel uncomfortable when there was a rant. It was such a relief when I learnt that I didn't have to stick around, smooth things over or join in!! I didn't have to feel bad just because my husband chose to make a meal of it! 
. ((((hugs))))
Shame about the two hour rant, that sounds just like the noise my husband's gremlins used to make when they got indigestion as they chewed on the truth! We can learn new ways of dealing with those pesky monsters - or perhaps I should say 'ways of not dealing with them' instead.
-- Edited by milkwood on Wednesday 28th of December 2016 11:09:17 AM