Hello all. I havent been here in a while. Sadly the usual ups and downs of the disease has kept me preoccupied and not putting the focus of my program where I should. So much has occured that is irrepairable but my concern now (and has been for a while) is how to keep him from the kids. He's been in and out of rehab and continues to allow his addiction to rip our family apart. I've since taken the kids (and dog) and moved out but he cant seem to accept the boundary that I have put in place which is if he wants to spend time with us he has to be sober. Some days he's ok and others hes a train wreck. Until recently we have not seen or heard from him much. Now that his 6th job in a year has been threatened he's been sniffing around trying to hang out. I allowed it because well he had no money which meant he was sober when with us. Well he was able to con his employer back into getting his job back so now the remorse of his actions have now faded and he's back to his old behaviors.
I say all this to say after tripping over beer cans on my way into the house to get my girls yesterday I had to deny him the opportunity to come spend time with us at my house last night. My anger really set in after I realized.that he may have even been drinking when be went to pick up our 8yr old from day care. After re-explaining to him the "zero tolerance" boundary that I have set now he's pissed and trying to make trouble. (the usual blame game etc.) I reminded him that as long as he wishes to continue drinking he will not be allowed to have any co tact with them or me. Does anyone have expereince with visitation issues lime this with a spouse. We are not legally divorced or separated because neither of us can afford it so there nothing in writing that dictates visitation rules. Can it simy be what I say goes?
Lucy125 said
Nov 11, 2016
That's so terrible...I had family members that were a bad influence and I had to make a decision to keep them away. I can't advise anyone. Just a general principle that we are responsible for the care and well being of our children.
SerenityRUS said
Nov 11, 2016
There are consequences for every action. As long as you can accept that. Yes .. You can okay the because I said so card ... Here's the sticky wicket .. I don't advocate this unless you feel there is a safety issue. There is nothing in writing .. That means he can pick the kids up and there is nothing the day care can do because there is nothing in writing. With my x thankfully he really didn't want the kids and he was still is afraid of me. I'm grateful for that .. So he never knew or never tested me about picking the kids up. If he picks them up he is drunk or high whatever .. The daycare is obligated to call the police. It would help your case. What I did was document all contact he did or didn't have with the kids to present to court should there be any issues. I used it with the mediator and my attorney. You might want to consider going to legal aide to see if they could help you with a divorce or walking you through the process if that's what you decided to do. Without anything in writing you can decide when it's a good time for visitation remember so can he. I will tell you there was a weekend that I looked at my kids I just had a feeling something was odd.. And said this weekend is not a good weekend for visitation .. He totaled a car he just got .. Left the scene of the accident and hadn't even registered the car in his name at that point no insurance either. Listen to your gut. Again mine has no involvement with the kids we moved 800 miles away a year ago. He might text of his own accord once every 6 months. There is no relationship. There was none when we were in the same town. So pray think about what is best for the kids after watching my kids and other situations I'm glad at this point there is no relationship. It's easier for them .. It's not less painful .. It is easier. Hugs.
Hopefull15 said
Nov 11, 2016
The thing is that he is on one of his quarterly downward spirals again. I say quarterly because I truly believe something other than alhoholism is wrong with him. These downward spirals (depression, job loss, bad/eratic behavior and binge drinking etc) have happened every 3-4 months faithfully for the last 3 yrs and they always end with him having a come to Jesus moment, is remorsefull and teary eyed and be goes to rehab to 'get away from it all' and then he starts it all over again. The bad part he's aware of this pattern now and that there may be something else (mental) going on with him but he wont get help. Its exhausting to watch and like clockwork he eventually gets to the point of binging and then driving while super drunk. He told me that he on 2 occasions last week he went to a bar, got sloppy drunk, left to go home but never made it out of the parking lot ...just sat in the car passed out till the car nearly ran out of gas. Bottom line is that I dont want the kids with him when this eventually happens. While he hasnt presented to us personally in a sloppy drunk state yet, I cant say for sure that he hasnt already started on his downward spiral because we dont live under the same roof now. Either way its truly unpredictable when that part will kick in and where it'll happen...and because he ALWAYS wreaks of alcohol I cant possbly gauge the 'degree' of intoxication on any given day unless he's falling over drunk which he'll never give me the satisfaction of seeing. I wont know until the visit is over and he brings them back home. By then it will be too late.
At this point Im thinking ahead and where he's headed. I know his patterns and I just dont want to be bothered with the anxiety of will he be drunk when he brings them home this time. If I could rely on his family honoring my concerns and helping out it would be different but they have been acting real funny lately and have been avoiding co tact with me. Im convinced he's succeeded in turning them against me with all of the lies and bad mouthing that he's done about me. Lets just say they play a major role in his 'issues' but he doesnt want to admit it. Major acceptance issues going on there and truth be told they dont really know him like I know him because of the facade he puts up when he's around them...but I digress....bottom line his people cant be trusted to do the right thing either.
I'm.sorry for such a long post...its been way too long since being on the boards. This is the first time in a long time that I've felt hopeless and helpless at.the same time and I absolutely hate it.....I moved out so that I could get some peace but being that kids are involved its still been intermitten chaos. I notice that when he starts to.spiral.out of control, so do I right along with him. Gonna start going back to meetings starting tonight. I've tried doing the online thing and reading literature on my own but its no longer working.
Mattie said
Nov 11, 2016
I'm afraid I have to write quickly for time reasons, but here's what my lawyer advised me. He said document, document, document - write down every time he's visibly drunk when he comes to pick them up, or whatever - any recordings or photos etc. you can get without causing problem are also good, but a record is important. I assumed that my A would always be drunk, and so I set up a regular schedule and never allowed him to have unsupervised access. He had from 1-3 pm on Sunday afternoons, we'd all walk to a pizza place or whatever. If he were falling-down drunk I would have said no, but that only happened once or twice, and I sent him away without telling him why because I didn't want to get into a fight - just said "Our kid is a little sick today, so let's do next week instead" and he was okay with that. Anyway, my lawyer said that once we have a pattern established, the court will just continue with that unless there's a big reason not to. So the two hours every Sunday would be the thing they'd continue with. I had all the documentation ready to go in case he fought me on the custody, but as it happened he didn't. One thing is that A's want a lot of time to drink and party and pass out - they don't want the responsibility of children. They often just want to swoop in and see them once in a while and then go off and do the drinking. So if you can keep it from becoming a power struggle (I know with some A's that's hard), he may be just as happy that you'll do all the heavy lifting. I hope you can find some good legal aid that is experienced with alcoholics. But that's what my lawyer told me.
SerenityRUS said
Nov 11, 2016
I strongly suggest you get a sponsor and support. My x did a similar dance and it was extremely predictable. His was more like every 6 weeks. And yes there were additional issues. He wound up in the pshych ward after violating a tro because he got way out of control. You may want to talk to a DV unit .. I found his episodes to get more intense as things went on. He was hallucinating about me dating .. Other men .. He was having men from his work follow me home and I lived in the country. When I got the tro these men decided to leave me alone since they worked for a union I could have them fired .. It's a harassment law that HR could have invoked.. Understand I was very done at that point. I have 1000 other stories .. Reality is I didn't feel safe and my children were not safe and her was actively drinking at the time. He also took script meds while drinking. For me .. Safety first. Again I'm not sorry we moved .. He's better now however no relationship with the kids. Hugs it gets better.
Iamhere said
Nov 12, 2016
Hopeful - I have no direct experience but wanted to send you positive thoughts and prayers. I know in my state that unless there is court documented proof that a parent is a danger to a child, there is not a judge that will restrict custody or visitation. Documentation is not enough - there has to be proof. Treatment centers and hospital stays are not enough either as they are considered medical records, and protected by HIPPA laws. My best suggestion is to get legal advice and bury yourself in recovery.
I've watched countless friends spend tons of $$ and end up with joint custody. In our state, unless there is court documentation, both parents have equal rights to pull the children from daycare, school, events, etc. Even a verbal agreement is not disputable in court unless/until it's officially documented. Friends of mine who've done tried to force restrictions without legal consent have been penalized during the court process. So - do your homework, understand your state's family laws and seek counsel from any/all resources available.
(((Hugs))) - I hear your concerns and they are valid....follow the process outlined in your area and trust the process.
That's so terrible...I had family members that were a bad influence and I had to make a decision to keep them away. I can't advise anyone. Just a general principle that we are responsible for the care and well being of our children.
I'm afraid I have to write quickly for time reasons, but here's what my lawyer advised me. He said document, document, document - write down every time he's visibly drunk when he comes to pick them up, or whatever - any recordings or photos etc. you can get without causing problem are also good, but a record is important. I assumed that my A would always be drunk, and so I set up a regular schedule and never allowed him to have unsupervised access. He had from 1-3 pm on Sunday afternoons, we'd all walk to a pizza place or whatever. If he were falling-down drunk I would have said no, but that only happened once or twice, and I sent him away without telling him why because I didn't want to get into a fight - just said "Our kid is a little sick today, so let's do next week instead" and he was okay with that. Anyway, my lawyer said that once we have a pattern established, the court will just continue with that unless there's a big reason not to. So the two hours every Sunday would be the thing they'd continue with. I had all the documentation ready to go in case he fought me on the custody, but as it happened he didn't. One thing is that A's want a lot of time to drink and party and pass out - they don't want the responsibility of children. They often just want to swoop in and see them once in a while and then go off and do the drinking. So if you can keep it from becoming a power struggle (I know with some A's that's hard), he may be just as happy that you'll do all the heavy lifting. I hope you can find some good legal aid that is experienced with alcoholics. But that's what my lawyer told me.
I've watched countless friends spend tons of $$ and end up with joint custody. In our state, unless there is court documentation, both parents have equal rights to pull the children from daycare, school, events, etc. Even a verbal agreement is not disputable in court unless/until it's officially documented. Friends of mine who've done tried to force restrictions without legal consent have been penalized during the court process. So - do your homework, understand your state's family laws and seek counsel from any/all resources available.
(((Hugs))) - I hear your concerns and they are valid....follow the process outlined in your area and trust the process.