Please forgive me this is a long post. I guess I'll start at the beginning. My AH got sober and and went into recovery/AA about 8 years ago. About 5 years ago he "befriended" a young woman in AA. They became fast friends. She was newly married at the time. Her new husband got transferred with the military and moved away. Fast forward 5 years to August of 2106. They are once again transferred back to my city. On the move cross country she relapses...again, Goes into treatment in my city and reenters my husbands life. The friendship starts out just as any old acquaintance does, especially newly sober and needing support. However, I quickly started feeling insecure about this friendship. Which is very uncharacteristic of me. He invited her everywhere we went, talked about her constantly, even started comparing me to her. I felt uneasy for weeks, even discussing this with AH. Said I was crazy, unhappy, jealous, controlling etc...AH went on a men's trip to fish for the weekend in early October. I logged into cell account to check for my phone update. WOW! Did I get a rude awakening.He called her sometimes 10 times a day for 2 months. Sometimes the calls lasted 25, 30 or 45 minutes. Multiple times a day. AND texting all day everyday. He even called her from his mens fishing trip. Upon his return I confronted him with this and HE BLAMED ME!! Said I didn't love him enough. I made him move out that day. I immediately went back to Alanon and dove in. Messing up many times and begged him to stop texting, calling seeing her. He says I'm controlling and she's just a friend. Refuses to stop. I know she is his addiction now and everytime I ask him to stop its as if I'm asking him to not drink. I told him I wanted to reconcile but only if she was out of our lives. He says he can't do that. I guess 29 years of marriage is over. I haven't had any contact with him in 8 days. It hurts to know he is active addiction and choosing addiction over his family.
maryjane said
Nov 9, 2016
I'm sorry for what you are experiencing. My hubby of (at that time) 35 years was befriending a lady in AA. I know it was platonic but I hated the smug way he talked about her...... like he owned her. When I told him it was over the line he accused me of being jealous. Detachment works . You don't have to do it with love. Just detach. Treat him like the neighbor. You know him, you care about him, but are not all tied up with him. You are not crazy. She left but now I know what the AH is capable of.
hotrod said
Nov 9, 2016
Welcome MMG. Glad that you shared and returned to alanon. This disease over which we are powerless, is indeed dreadful.
There is hope so please keep coming back
Iamhere said
Nov 9, 2016
I too send warm welcomes to you MMG.....I truly don't have any experience in this arena but love what was shared about detaching. I do believe it would bother me as well if I were in your shoes. I happen to come from a large metro area though and we really do suggest that same sex folks sponsor each other - cross pollination is really discouraged. I know this is a challenge in smaller towns/areas but that's my experience.
Glad that you're back into Al-Anon and working it. Keep coming back - glad you're part of our MIP family!!
(((Hugs)))
Jerry F said
Nov 9, 2016
This is a great post!! So eye opening and thoughtful for this recovering male who has to remind himself of how things actually work in my relationship with my wife and others. The fears and trials and tribulations are experienced by both my wife and I. Yes we love and trust each other and it is the unknown...unexpected presence of the stranger which raises questions. I always keep that thought in mind and hold my wife in highest esteem even in the presence of others. I know where she comes from as to her experiences especially with a former alcoholic husband and the pain needed to be over with for both of us as I also carried my own relationship crosses. I was crazy...certifiably so. I rather have the peace of mind and serenity that the program gives us today. (((((hugs)))))
2HP said
Nov 9, 2016
I relate to him turning the tables and making YOU the problem, that manipulation worked well for my husband too.
I had a few male friends in recovery before I met my current partner. when we became committed, I ended those relationships even though I considered them "harmless." I wanted my partner to be happy in every way, and that included feeling safe.
I also knew I wouldn't want HIM talking with other women about such intimate matters.....recovery is personal! only qualified spiritual teachers or marriage counselors are the exception. I value loyalty in my relationships and so I choose to "be" the partner that I myself want to have.
I so sympathize with (((you))) You are NOT crazy.
Calm Lady said
Nov 10, 2016
I hear you about it all being twisted into you being the problem!
Crazy making. Supportive hugs and prayers to you.
a4l said
Nov 10, 2016
I'm so sorry to read this. No, you do not sound crazy to me. The situation sounds baffling. Glad you are here and keep coming back.
Mattie said
Nov 10, 2016
If he were unhappy with his marriage, the mature thing to do would be to get counseling, or to end the marriage well before starting up any kind of intense emotional connection with another woman. "I was unhappy" does not justify "Therefore I got all close to this woman while I was still in my marriage." I think we can see his own internal "logic" there - a very childish logic.
Glad you are taking good care of yourself. It's just mind-boggling when people do this kind of thing. If my own experience is any guide, this won't be the last you see of him. "It's hard to get rid of an alcoholic." I hope you can brace yourself and figure out what you want before he starts again with some kind of manipulation. Hang in there.
mmg330 said
Nov 10, 2016
Mattie,
Thank you for your insightful reply. I have gone over it a 1000 times in my head. Your words really hit me. Yes, if he was unhappy in our marriage he should have let me know. We just bought a beautiful boat together. It took us months to find the right one. Its what we love to do. I am trying very hard to not be crazy and to take care of myself. Thank God for Alanon. Its keeping me somewhat together and functioning. 29 years of marriage is a long time. I honestly don't think he will be back. He isn't willing to give this relationship up. I'm so humiliated by it all, I hope in a way, he doesn't come back. Either way, I know with Alanon I can survive and be happy again some day. Thanks for taking time out of your day to write to me.
Mattie said
Nov 10, 2016
I hope it's okay if I stick my oar in again. The thing about these zealous early-days romances is how unrealistic they are. As you say, it's more like an addiction than a friendship. All the texts and phone calls and unavailability and yearning. I think a lot of us have actually been through that on the other side of it, I mean the yearning after someone who wasn't really available. (This woman is not really "available" for several reasons. For one, she's in early recovery for this stage of her recommittment to recovery. People are advised to stay out of starting relationships in early recovery. Plus since he was already in a marriage, he was not a free agent. So there's the whole "forbidden fruit" aspect of the thing, full of "if only"s and "what if"s and all kinds of delicious illusions of how it would be paradise if they only got together, blah blah blah. Plus, is her husband still in the picture?)
Anyway, presumably they are now embarking on that fabulous relationship they dreamed of, even though it's painful to think so. Even though both of them are immature emotionally and she is in early recovery and he has not got his head straight. In my experience, I can maybe keep the illusion of perfection and wonderfulness going for up to six months, and then real life starts to creep in. Turns out the other person isn't perfect. Turns out when problems come up, I don't always have a lot of practice at handling them. Turns out you bring your old self into new relationships. Turns out that intensity and forbiddenness are not really realistic foundations upon which to build a relationship, and are not really signs that it's "meant to be." Cold hard reality sets in. Then the cheater realizes, "I blew up my whole life for ... this?" Hard to know who to blame then. Probably he will then blame her. Because it's a sign of immaturity not to be able to say "What's my own part in this?"
That's why I say he may be back. I've known situations where the cheater was trying to keep both women at once - because being wholly available to one woman was too frightening to him.
It's so hard in these circumstances to turn our minds away from the trainwreck to making our own lives better. But it sure pays off. Hang in there. Take good care of yourself.
Please forgive me this is a long post. I guess I'll start at the beginning. My AH got sober and and went into recovery/AA about 8 years ago. About 5 years ago he "befriended" a young woman in AA. They became fast friends. She was newly married at the time. Her new husband got transferred with the military and moved away. Fast forward 5 years to August of 2106. They are once again transferred back to my city. On the move cross country she relapses...again, Goes into treatment in my city and reenters my husbands life. The friendship starts out just as any old acquaintance does, especially newly sober and needing support. However, I quickly started feeling insecure about this friendship. Which is very uncharacteristic of me. He invited her everywhere we went, talked about her constantly, even started comparing me to her. I felt uneasy for weeks, even discussing this with AH. Said I was crazy, unhappy, jealous, controlling etc...AH went on a men's trip to fish for the weekend in early October. I logged into cell account to check for my phone update. WOW! Did I get a rude awakening.He called her sometimes 10 times a day for 2 months. Sometimes the calls lasted 25, 30 or 45 minutes. Multiple times a day. AND texting all day everyday. He even called her from his mens fishing trip. Upon his return I confronted him with this and HE BLAMED ME!! Said I didn't love him enough. I made him move out that day. I immediately went back to Alanon and dove in. Messing up many times and begged him to stop texting, calling seeing her. He says I'm controlling and she's just a friend. Refuses to stop. I know she is his addiction now and everytime I ask him to stop its as if I'm asking him to not drink. I told him I wanted to reconcile but only if she was out of our lives. He says he can't do that. I guess 29 years of marriage is over. I haven't had any contact with him in 8 days. It hurts to know he is active addiction and choosing addiction over his family.
Welcome MMG. Glad that you shared and returned to alanon. This disease over which we are powerless, is indeed dreadful.
There is hope so please keep coming back
Glad that you're back into Al-Anon and working it. Keep coming back - glad you're part of our MIP family!!
(((Hugs)))
This is a great post!! So eye opening and thoughtful for this recovering male who has to remind himself of how things actually work in my relationship with my wife and others. The fears and trials and tribulations are experienced by both my wife and I. Yes we love and trust each other and it is the unknown...unexpected presence of the stranger which raises questions. I always keep that thought in mind and hold my wife in highest esteem even in the presence of others. I know where she comes from as to her experiences especially with a former alcoholic husband and the pain needed to be over with for both of us as I also carried my own relationship crosses. I was crazy...certifiably so. I rather have the peace of mind and serenity that the program gives us today. (((((hugs)))))
I had a few male friends in recovery before I met my current partner. when we became committed, I ended those relationships even though I considered them "harmless." I wanted my partner to be happy in every way, and that included feeling safe.
I also knew I wouldn't want HIM talking with other women about such intimate matters.....recovery is personal! only qualified spiritual teachers or marriage counselors are the exception. I value loyalty in my relationships and so I choose to "be" the partner that I myself want to have.
I so sympathize with (((you))) You are NOT crazy.
Crazy making. Supportive hugs and prayers to you.
If he were unhappy with his marriage, the mature thing to do would be to get counseling, or to end the marriage well before starting up any kind of intense emotional connection with another woman. "I was unhappy" does not justify "Therefore I got all close to this woman while I was still in my marriage." I think we can see his own internal "logic" there - a very childish logic.
Glad you are taking good care of yourself. It's just mind-boggling when people do this kind of thing. If my own experience is any guide, this won't be the last you see of him. "It's hard to get rid of an alcoholic." I hope you can brace yourself and figure out what you want before he starts again with some kind of manipulation. Hang in there.
Mattie,
Thank you for your insightful reply. I have gone over it a 1000 times in my head. Your words really hit me. Yes, if he was unhappy in our marriage he should have let me know. We just bought a beautiful boat together. It took us months to find the right one. Its what we love to do. I am trying very hard to not be crazy and to take care of myself. Thank God for Alanon. Its keeping me somewhat together and functioning. 29 years of marriage is a long time. I honestly don't think he will be back. He isn't willing to give this relationship up. I'm so humiliated by it all, I hope in a way, he doesn't come back. Either way, I know with Alanon I can survive and be happy again some day. Thanks for taking time out of your day to write to me.
I hope it's okay if I stick my oar in again. The thing about these zealous early-days romances is how unrealistic they are. As you say, it's more like an addiction than a friendship. All the texts and phone calls and unavailability and yearning. I think a lot of us have actually been through that on the other side of it, I mean the yearning after someone who wasn't really available. (This woman is not really "available" for several reasons. For one, she's in early recovery for this stage of her recommittment to recovery. People are advised to stay out of starting relationships in early recovery. Plus since he was already in a marriage, he was not a free agent. So there's the whole "forbidden fruit" aspect of the thing, full of "if only"s and "what if"s and all kinds of delicious illusions of how it would be paradise if they only got together, blah blah blah. Plus, is her husband still in the picture?)
Anyway, presumably they are now embarking on that fabulous relationship they dreamed of, even though it's painful to think so. Even though both of them are immature emotionally and she is in early recovery and he has not got his head straight. In my experience, I can maybe keep the illusion of perfection and wonderfulness going for up to six months, and then real life starts to creep in. Turns out the other person isn't perfect. Turns out when problems come up, I don't always have a lot of practice at handling them. Turns out you bring your old self into new relationships. Turns out that intensity and forbiddenness are not really realistic foundations upon which to build a relationship, and are not really signs that it's "meant to be." Cold hard reality sets in. Then the cheater realizes, "I blew up my whole life for ... this?" Hard to know who to blame then. Probably he will then blame her. Because it's a sign of immaturity not to be able to say "What's my own part in this?"
That's why I say he may be back. I've known situations where the cheater was trying to keep both women at once - because being wholly available to one woman was too frightening to him.
It's so hard in these circumstances to turn our minds away from the trainwreck to making our own lives better. But it sure pays off. Hang in there. Take good care of yourself.