Tough time staying strong this AM with the tools. AH not using alcohol for two weeks but high as a kite for any time not at work is angry because I told him to stay out after not showing up home Monday night and returning Tuesday with a lie that changes by the hour about how he was just too stoned and chose not to drive (uber)...passed out but didn't mean to...whatever. This morning he still contends to be desperate to repair our relationship and doesn't lie but things don't work because it's always something with me and I'm never happy. Came up with nothing when I asked why I heard nothing from him last night when he knew there was an event for our daughter. I kept texting he is making his own choices and my daughter and I have a right to everything I expect that he is not doing. Then I get the text that throws me. He says so he eats/smokes a little weed, so what - and I should see a doctor of my own for mental illness...and to leave him alone because he is at IOP. Why does my mind leap to a room full of drug addicts and alcoholics, who nothing seems to stick to, agreeing his wife is such a @$&! and a counselor who points out how unhelpful I am being to his recovery (by being a feeling, thinking, breathing human being thinking of myself and child instead of the poor addict). It's like a nightmare I'm not waking up from. Trying serenity prayer, trying to do the next best thing, trying to turn it over...still seeing red. Good words please.
jojo8466 said
Oct 28, 2016
I'm so sorry you are going through this. I am praying that things get better for you and your daughter soon. You and her both deserve peace and happiness in your life.
Mike B said
Oct 28, 2016
Hi SMS, I remember those feelings- sucks. Remember that you're dealing with the insanity of the disease. You can't hold rational conversations or reasonable expectations with someone who is insane or using. That's why it's so frustrating. There's no truth or rational to it.
I'm not responsible for the choices of others. I'm only responsible for mine. In the grips of Alcoholism, it was always my fault(blame) and still is(5 years later). That's part of the manipulation that the Alcoholic uses to get the focus off them and make us feel bad/less about ourselves. Truly a cunning, baffling & powerful disease.
What I learned to do was switch the focus to me and what I could do to help myself. The other person could help themselves if they so chose- which they didn't. As I focused on me and my recovery the answers soon materialized. What I did was to start to put myself first and set-up boundaries for my peace & serenity. I did this based on what were my deal breakers in my relationship. My wife at the time ran right through those boundaries. When the pain of living of where I was at got to be more than the fear of where I could be, I made a decision to keep her out for good. I learned that no relationship is better than a bad one. It's the best thing that I could've done. Nothing changes if nothing changes is such a powerful principle.
Iamhere said
Oct 28, 2016
Well.....the best I can share is an altered mind is an altered mind. I have been called terrible things by my qualifiers in various states of 'mental capacity'. It hurts, there is no doubt about it. And, of course, it's completely inappropriate. My sponsor kept having to remind me that I am expecting adult rational behavior from one just not capable of giving it. It was my choice to allow it and them to control my day, my emotions or not. Sorry it's not super pleasant or positive but that's the reality of our program.
Sometimes, I just have to consider the source and realize I am dealing with a sick person. Also, I can almost promise you that he's not sharing in IOP that he's treating his alcoholism with pot. Therefore I am also doubtful that he's able to explain, define or complain about your reactions to his treatment choice. Unless IOP has changed drastically since I last attended, using any mind-altering substance was grounds for termination from the program/treatment. They truly try to help those who want help. It's possible the rules have changed - we last exposure to IOP was 3-4 years ago.
You are 100% correct that you (and your daughter) have every right to plan, do, act, enjoy. There is no shame in making your plans and doing them. Where the program helped me avoid crazy/dramatic discussions with my active qualifier was using JADE - Don't Justify, Argue, Defend or Explain. Plan and do and enjoy.
I first had to detach with indifference and as I learned more about the disease, I was better able to detach with love/empathy. Many never get to the detaching with love, and that's acceptable to them. I could not harbor any more hurt and anger in my heart any more - not another darn day! For me to find true serenity and joy, I had to find an acceptable way to forgive, let go and let God. For me, the answers were in the program - all of it - meetings, sponsor, steps, service, practice, practice and more practice.
I am sorry that you're still engaged with the disease actively. It's such a hard place to be. I made sure I always had a Plan B and Plan C in those days as my emotional response to their disease was unpredictable at times and over the top at others. I wanted desperately to change that which I could - me.
Breathe in and think of something just for you to do/have/enjoy. Anything helps - and of course, my abbreviated serenity prayer - Bless Them, Change Me!!! (((Hugs)))
sunmustshine said
Oct 28, 2016
The fury has passed. I feel such comfort from the things you all share. Your prayers, experiences and reminders of the slogans help me know I'll get through it. I can't help but feel afraid of finding compassion for him because it feels like a set up. I thought I understood detachment with love until I found myself disappointed over and over. Detach with love to living with peace to being blindsided again. It was like I would feel so hurt by his vanishing after what seemed like understanding and new beginnings only to have it all repeat. Now he's waiting for the repeat and I can't/am afraid/purposefully am stopping myself from feeling compassion because I know it means pain. That's not detaching with love, its shutting down. Detaching with love feels so much like opening myself (and daughter) up to be smashed again. I guess I'm confused. Detaching with love doesn't seem to be working.
Calm Lady said
Oct 28, 2016
Warm thoughts and prayers to you, I relate to what you share.
Jayla said
Oct 29, 2016
I am learning so much from reading this post too! The idea not to JADE was very helpful. I noticed quite a while ago that I just could not discuss anything with AH when he's been drinking (which is pretty much all the time he's not at work). He's so unreasonable and rude and hateful (probably a lot like what you are going through sunmustshine). I keep getting pulled into that JADE stuff from
His needling. It was also helpful to read that you can't expect rational adult behavior from a sick person. I had never thought of it that way.
Fooled said
Oct 29, 2016
For me, detaching with love was more like I love my A enough to let go and let God handle things. I had no control therefore turning him over to the only person who does.
Jerry F said
Oct 29, 2016
Maybe the MIP family can share their definitions of love with you and some of it will help. I learned from an Al-Anon old timer her definition after one Thursday night meeting and she shared her loving relationship with her alcoholic. I was stunned and confused because it didn't fit my definition at all and I thought that her explanation was too quaint so I chased/followed her to her car after the meeting and told her I needed to know her definition of love and she gave me this which still is now my own definition of love...."Love is the complete and total acceptance of every other human being for exactly who they are". She didn't mention her alcoholic and what she gave me was personal value system that I could practice easily every day and minute of the day. There were no soft and warm fuzzies in it or great adoration for some one else...it was acceptance without condition and she turned and left me with a huge pot of gold. Presently it is very difficult not to love others...all others and I am so grateful for it.
HP knows how to shake my tree. (((((hugs)))))
a4l said
Oct 30, 2016
Aw, hugs. For what its worth, I did IOP years ago, but it was IOP for US the alanonics. There were a few doubles as well. I can say in all honesty there was never any bitch and moan sessions about partners. We were always made to keep the focus on ourselves and held accountable to this principle by each other and the counsellors. So while your imagining the worst what ifs , how about, what if not? Have faith and hang in there! ((Sun must shine))
Hi SMS, I remember those feelings- sucks. Remember that you're dealing with the insanity of the disease. You can't hold rational conversations or reasonable expectations with someone who is insane or using. That's why it's so frustrating. There's no truth or rational to it.
I'm not responsible for the choices of others. I'm only responsible for mine. In the grips of Alcoholism, it was always my fault(blame) and still is(5 years later). That's part of the manipulation that the Alcoholic uses to get the focus off them and make us feel bad/less about ourselves. Truly a cunning, baffling & powerful disease.
What I learned to do was switch the focus to me and what I could do to help myself. The other person could help themselves if they so chose- which they didn't. As I focused on me and my recovery the answers soon materialized. What I did was to start to put myself first and set-up boundaries for my peace & serenity. I did this based on what were my deal breakers in my relationship. My wife at the time ran right through those boundaries. When the pain of living of where I was at got to be more than the fear of where I could be, I made a decision to keep her out for good. I learned that no relationship is better than a bad one. It's the best thing that I could've done. Nothing changes if nothing changes is such a powerful principle.
Sometimes, I just have to consider the source and realize I am dealing with a sick person. Also, I can almost promise you that he's not sharing in IOP that he's treating his alcoholism with pot. Therefore I am also doubtful that he's able to explain, define or complain about your reactions to his treatment choice. Unless IOP has changed drastically since I last attended, using any mind-altering substance was grounds for termination from the program/treatment. They truly try to help those who want help. It's possible the rules have changed - we last exposure to IOP was 3-4 years ago.
You are 100% correct that you (and your daughter) have every right to plan, do, act, enjoy. There is no shame in making your plans and doing them. Where the program helped me avoid crazy/dramatic discussions with my active qualifier was using JADE - Don't Justify, Argue, Defend or Explain. Plan and do and enjoy.
I first had to detach with indifference and as I learned more about the disease, I was better able to detach with love/empathy. Many never get to the detaching with love, and that's acceptable to them. I could not harbor any more hurt and anger in my heart any more - not another darn day! For me to find true serenity and joy, I had to find an acceptable way to forgive, let go and let God. For me, the answers were in the program - all of it - meetings, sponsor, steps, service, practice, practice and more practice.
I am sorry that you're still engaged with the disease actively. It's such a hard place to be. I made sure I always had a Plan B and Plan C in those days as my emotional response to their disease was unpredictable at times and over the top at others. I wanted desperately to change that which I could - me.
Breathe in and think of something just for you to do/have/enjoy. Anything helps - and of course, my abbreviated serenity prayer - Bless Them, Change Me!!! (((Hugs)))
Maybe the MIP family can share their definitions of love with you and some of it will help. I learned from an Al-Anon old timer her definition after one Thursday night meeting and she shared her loving relationship with her alcoholic. I was stunned and confused because it didn't fit my definition at all and I thought that her explanation was too quaint so I chased/followed her to her car after the meeting and told her I needed to know her definition of love and she gave me this which still is now my own definition of love...."Love is the complete and total acceptance of every other human being for exactly who they are". She didn't mention her alcoholic and what she gave me was personal value system that I could practice easily every day and minute of the day. There were no soft and warm fuzzies in it or great adoration for some one else...it was acceptance without condition and she turned and left me with a huge pot of gold. Presently it is very difficult not to love others...all others and I am so grateful for it.
HP knows how to shake my tree. (((((hugs)))))