Question for those who stayed and AH is/was in recovery (or double winners)
Doingmybest said
Aug 6, 2016
Hello my MIP Friends,
i was wondering if anyone would be willing to share some esh on the first two to three years with a RAH. Mine is at the16 month mark this week and we are getting along wonderfully, however, I do find that we still have serious intimacy issues, Many are related to the medical issue he has and the need for antidepressants and I do not blame him in any way.
Honestly, it feels that he is never home anymore (like when he was drinking). He travels for his job and goes to meetings every day when home. We live in a rural area that requires he drive quite a way for meetings and he also leaved at least 2-3 hours earlier than he "has" to, but says he enjoys the place and the company of people in recovery and likes to go early to talk to his sponsor or to his sponsee. Friday nights are always very late due to some additional meetings he attends after the first one and he also goes on Saturday afternoon and Sunday afternoon. He used to stop and spend a day or two with me doing something (which he claims was balance), but now we just spend time watching movies after his meetings. I am NOT complaining about this because he is a good husband now and I can count on him. He treats me well and stands behind me...I'm having some serious medical issues that may be life threatening in addition to my normal chronic pain right...he is doing an excellent job of offering love and support.
It may seem I am concentrating on his behaviors...I guess I am to some extent. It is simply that I feel quite lonely at times. I do enjoy my own company and I do have plenty to do with my time. I enjoy my life as much as I can and I spend quality time with my daughter (a teen) as much as anyone with a teen can. My extended family is too chaotic and has too man "isms" for me to be around them much. I have not told them about new medical issue (I already have one life limiting one that gives you about 10 years from diagnosis...2 Years ago) and don't want to tell them this until I know for certain (at the end of August or first of September).
My only close friend is one of us...married to an addict (prescription meds), but is NOT a believer in AlAnon, so it is rather impossible to discuss things with her from an AlAnon perspective.
I do not doubt where my RAH is or what he is doing. I no longer check his phones (work/home), check his "location", or even open his packages. I do still handle the bills because we both feel that is my "part" and he does other things for his part. I am medically retired so I have more free time.
If someone who stayed through recovery would please give some esh on the recovery process for A's truly working the program, I would greatly appreciate it. I'm feeling somewhat "neglected", though I think it may be only my perception. I feel lonely for physical touch (not sexual intimacy) because the meds seem to take away all "touchy-feely" behavior and I miss it. We have discussed this and I know going off meds is not the answer. (He has done so twice to try to regain intimacy and the results were awful....with frustration, loud voices, and unreasonable outbursts not characteristic to his personality pre or post program).
ESH Please???? I just want info to know if this is all normal and what happens "normally" down the line. I'm not going anywhere and am very satisfied with my life overall, but I miss the "us". Perhaps I am just in greater need because this condition (possible/likely) is usually a death sentence and very unpleasant for everyone.
hotrod said
Aug 6, 2016
Hi DMB I believe I was simply grateful for the sobriety and that he was engaged with sober friends that i made myself busy with alanon face to face meetings, my son and doing my thing.
We did make time on weekends to enjoy time together which included intimacy once a week. That was after I felt as you have just described and had a discussion on the issue. Keep on taking car of yourself and being honest about how you feel It will improve.
pinkchip said
Aug 6, 2016
He has over a year sober so he should be capable of some insight here. Maybe some marital counseling? Not because you are unhappy with him persay, but this is a difficult adjustment and you guys need to redefine your marriage a bit too. I have been sober almost 8 years and take meds that have those effects. I got used to them and learned to function on them. BUT...I am unusual I guess with physical closeness for being a guy. I always want that and most partners except my hisband now (thank God ) have been like "Ugh! Stop hanging on me!" So I can't relate to that part. I can say I lived in an AA bubble for like 2 years before focusing more on other things and "non program" friends/activities and such. Now AA is central in my mind, but not consuming all my time. That may happen here.
Doingmybest said
Aug 6, 2016
Thank you both. I am not certain the counseling is necessary now because I feel it may interfere with our individual programs and our rural area leaves very few knowledgeable counsellors for families working these programs. I will give it more time before really getting too down, I hope. I know each person is different and think he may have some medical conditions which may need to be addressed in that area as well. I will mention it, but will not push. Treatment is his decision because it is his body.
I believe my new medical concern and lack of available close support may be playing a role in my own neediness and I do not wish to put my needs above his sobriety....because with his sobriety, I do not have the strength to be in the relationship and 21 years is too long to throw away for a little down period. If I can live with active alcoholism for that long, I can deal with this and see if he learns his own balance (rather than doing EXACTLY what his sponsor tells him to do). The two year mark may be a better judge.
It also must be hard for him to deal with my condition(s). Where he used to never understand that a hug to hard was extremely painful, he now senses pain from the sound of my voice or from the slightest flinch upon touch. He is also really scared about the potential cancer and what that entails with the other issues I face. The mixed connective tissue disorder is bad enough and has its own issues.
We are planing another trip (Alaska) next June and I will do everything in my power to keep my Reynauds under control and to bring the essential warming blankets and other pain control items for my back. If the cancers turns out to be something smaller than they think, I will be greatful, but I am scared and I think I am simply more needy than normal. If something does happen to me, I need him to remain sober for our daughter. I want them both to be happy should the worse come sooner rather than later. This is why I am trying to live my life in a more positive way and to do my part to keep my home a safe and happy place. Plus, I enjoy furnitue refinishing (antique) and design, and am getting in to plants (mostly herbs).
I truly appreciate knowing it can take a little longer for balance to set in for a recvocovery program. Yes, I will wait it out and I have no intention of leaving because of the lack of a few too many hugs. Practical suggestions are also appreciated.
Thank you!
milkwood said
Aug 7, 2016
(((((((Doingmybest)))))))
We moved to a rural area about ten years ago. Before that I had a very busy work and social life and although I loved the change in circumstances on many levels I did find that I felt lonely a lot of the time. A very new feeling for me! Rather than feeling isolated I decided that I needed people and to do things that I enjoy so I reach out as much as I can - for interaction and for experiences. I could do with your skills in furniture restoration by the way!
When my husband stopped drinking I imagined that we would get back to being open, being good friends to each other etc but that has taken a long time to happen. And I can not rely on just one person to fill my all needs for human contact anyway! Initially AH needed a lot of space, and then my own resentments got in the way. We are like two nervous wounded animals, wary of each other but wanting to be closer so we circle and try. Things work the best when we are each doing what pleases us as individuals - healing our own wounds.
I have noticed that the months following the two year mark have been much easier. As you say balance is, I think, an ever evolving lesson!
Coping when a life threatening disease looms must be quite frightening for both of you - it is such a powerful reminder to make the most of our days and easily brings up feelings of abandonment as well I imagine. Being able to ask for a gentle stroke or a soft kiss, feeling heard, is important to all of us at times like this. And I'm pretty certain that my husband would be completely flummoxed and conflicted about 'how to fix this.' and 'what about me' and 'I feel guilty about.' and I would just want to say to him 'however much time we have left, can we simply enjoy it and create good memories together' and then I would trip myself up by being nervous of saying that because of past hurts! Now look at me projecting. I am sorry! I'm leaving that bit in just in case it helps you to know that other people worry and and then I usually get in my own way! I wonder if there are classes or meetings in town for you, or perhaps a spa - you could hitch a ride with your husband from time to time!!
I'm smiling at the thought of seeing Alaska in June. It is a dream of mine - wow! Those long daylight hours and stunningly beautiful landscapes!!!
Sending gentle ((((hugs))))
-- Edited by milkwood on Sunday 7th of August 2016 01:16:56 AM
Doingmybest said
Aug 7, 2016
Thank you milkwood so very much. It feels like you "get" it and that means a lot. I completely understand the connection with others and I do try, but to be completely honest, I'm not really good with large groups...not because I don't enjoy other people, but because I don't like the loud, abrasive noises of people without good manners. I love to spend time with people who don't scream and yell or don't "slam" everybody they see. Otherwise, I'm honestly happier alone.
I was always in the "top of my class" and had a lots of friends growing up and I had lots of quasi-friends when working (20 years before I had to medically retire). I am well educated and enjoy talking with others on a wide variety of subjects. As much as I thought I would hate a cruise, I found it to be very enjoyable (most of the time), much more so than the trip to Maui because we were too close to too many people too much of the time. Peace and quiet are very important to me( and to my family). We simply enjoy the relaxation of the cruise and the companionship of very enjoyable people from so many other places.
You really hit the nail on the head with the spa thing because my daughter and I came accross an amazing deal (1/2 price minus $40.00) on an inflatable hot tub/spa. After an online review/comparison, we ended up paying about $190.00 for an Intex 6 person spa with all the bells and whistles. We even set it up in a flash earlier this week. Hubby tried it out yesterday for the first time. I added aroma therapy/muscle relaxing detox solution from the pool/spa store And it was amazing!
To my great surprise, he loves it! He pulled me against him, hugged me, and played the whole time. I commented that this was what I meant by snuggling and he outright asked if this would meet the snuggling "requirement" (not negative). He went on to say that snuggling in the bed is just too hard because of all of the pillows (I have to have them), his machine (CPaP), and the dogs (two Pomeranians). Despite our giant bed, it is still just complicated.
The point is that I was misreading the issue. He does want to be close (it is physical touch I miss so much), but doesn't want to hurt me physically.
I think I felt a thousand pounds lift.
I agree that one person can never make you happy or meet all of your needs and I don't want any person to be the whole of my life, but I do want that feeling of personal loving touch just for a while. Otherwise, I enjoy hobbies: taking something (furniture, decor, left over tiles...what have you) and making them in to lovely restorations to enjoy. I don't like clutter and can get too many, so I sell them at consignment or give them away, but I enjoy the process and the stress outlet. I just have to pace myself and not overdo it.
I just wanted you (and my other responders) to know how much I appreciate your communication and understanding. I may have passed the worst of the daily hell of alcoholism (for a while...or just for today), but I still have a great deal of work to do. I'm actively seeking a sponsor and have put out feelers. I'm hoping to find someone soon who will understand and work well with me and someone who will call it like it is. I feel I need to work the steps (4-12) to really be where I want to be. I have tried, but you really need someone to lead you through these.
Wish me luck in finding the right person...perhaps even this week at the meeting.
knit2thepoint said
Aug 7, 2016
My Ah has 6 months sober so I am not as far down this path as you are. One thing that has really helped me with the feelings of neglect when he is constantly at meetings is to attend with him. I know that not all A's are open to that idea but generally what we do is go out to dinner on Saturday and then we will both go the open meeting that his fellowship has at 10pm. I get to meet the people he spends all that time with and the car rides make the best for conversation. We talk about us as a couple and we talk about speakers story. I have found that I can identify with things said in AA meetings even if it is from a different view point. Some of his AA buddies have started asking me what I thought and they all find it interesting because they dont often get to hear the other side.
I was fortunate that the channels of communication never closed for us while he was actively using. I have the ability to say "I have been feeling kind of needy/anxious/angry do you think we can ____________________ today." Usually he is happy to oblige and I have never felt rejected afterwards. If anything I have found it prevents the feeling of resentment because there is no misunderstanding between us. Healthy expectations is a concept that has really changed our marriage and its something that we try and establish constantly.
Serious medical issues are nothing to down play. There is a heavy emotional burden that is placed on the patients shoulders as well as their loved ones. The waiting can be incredibly painful and causes a sense of grief. I recently found a program called Betterhelp (you can try free for 7 days) where you answer a range of questions and it then pairs you with you a therapist online. They are fully licensed and mine so far has been incredibly helpful. Mine specialized in family, marriage and addiction counseling so they are very knowledgeable with AA and Al Anon. I am able to send her messages on a private board like this one that only her and I can see and then she responds usually with in an hour or so. You can also arrange skype or appointments if that is easier. Another idea is to speak to your doctor there may be forums such as this that can offer support.
Hello my MIP Friends,
i was wondering if anyone would be willing to share some esh on the first two to three years with a RAH. Mine is at the16 month mark this week and we are getting along wonderfully, however, I do find that we still have serious intimacy issues, Many are related to the medical issue he has and the need for antidepressants and I do not blame him in any way.
Honestly, it feels that he is never home anymore (like when he was drinking). He travels for his job and goes to meetings every day when home. We live in a rural area that requires he drive quite a way for meetings and he also leaved at least 2-3 hours earlier than he "has" to, but says he enjoys the place and the company of people in recovery and likes to go early to talk to his sponsor or to his sponsee. Friday nights are always very late due to some additional meetings he attends after the first one and he also goes on Saturday afternoon and Sunday afternoon. He used to stop and spend a day or two with me doing something (which he claims was balance), but now we just spend time watching movies after his meetings. I am NOT complaining about this because he is a good husband now and I can count on him. He treats me well and stands behind me...I'm having some serious medical issues that may be life threatening in addition to my normal chronic pain right...he is doing an excellent job of offering love and support.
It may seem I am concentrating on his behaviors...I guess I am to some extent. It is simply that I feel quite lonely at times. I do enjoy my own company and I do have plenty to do with my time. I enjoy my life as much as I can and I spend quality time with my daughter (a teen) as much as anyone with a teen can. My extended family is too chaotic and has too man "isms" for me to be around them much. I have not told them about new medical issue (I already have one life limiting one that gives you about 10 years from diagnosis...2 Years ago) and don't want to tell them this until I know for certain (at the end of August or first of September).
My only close friend is one of us...married to an addict (prescription meds), but is NOT a believer in AlAnon, so it is rather impossible to discuss things with her from an AlAnon perspective.
I do not doubt where my RAH is or what he is doing. I no longer check his phones (work/home), check his "location", or even open his packages. I do still handle the bills because we both feel that is my "part" and he does other things for his part. I am medically retired so I have more free time.
If someone who stayed through recovery would please give some esh on the recovery process for A's truly working the program, I would greatly appreciate it. I'm feeling somewhat "neglected", though I think it may be only my perception. I feel lonely for physical touch (not sexual intimacy) because the meds seem to take away all "touchy-feely" behavior and I miss it. We have discussed this and I know going off meds is not the answer. (He has done so twice to try to regain intimacy and the results were awful....with frustration, loud voices, and unreasonable outbursts not characteristic to his personality pre or post program).
ESH Please???? I just want info to know if this is all normal and what happens "normally" down the line. I'm not going anywhere and am very satisfied with my life overall, but I miss the "us". Perhaps I am just in greater need because this condition (possible/likely) is usually a death sentence and very unpleasant for everyone.
We did make time on weekends to enjoy time together which included intimacy once a week. That was after I felt as you have just described and had a discussion on the issue. Keep on taking car of yourself and being honest about how you feel It will improve.
I believe my new medical concern and lack of available close support may be playing a role in my own neediness and I do not wish to put my needs above his sobriety....because with his sobriety, I do not have the strength to be in the relationship and 21 years is too long to throw away for a little down period. If I can live with active alcoholism for that long, I can deal with this and see if he learns his own balance (rather than doing EXACTLY what his sponsor tells him to do). The two year mark may be a better judge.
It also must be hard for him to deal with my condition(s). Where he used to never understand that a hug to hard was extremely painful, he now senses pain from the sound of my voice or from the slightest flinch upon touch. He is also really scared about the potential cancer and what that entails with the other issues I face. The mixed connective tissue disorder is bad enough and has its own issues.
We are planing another trip (Alaska) next June and I will do everything in my power to keep my Reynauds under control and to bring the essential warming blankets and other pain control items for my back. If the cancers turns out to be something smaller than they think, I will be greatful, but I am scared and I think I am simply more needy than normal. If something does happen to me, I need him to remain sober for our daughter. I want them both to be happy should the worse come sooner rather than later. This is why I am trying to live my life in a more positive way and to do my part to keep my home a safe and happy place. Plus, I enjoy furnitue refinishing (antique) and design, and am getting in to plants (mostly herbs).
I truly appreciate knowing it can take a little longer for balance to set in for a recvocovery program. Yes, I will wait it out and I have no intention of leaving because of the lack of a few too many hugs. Practical suggestions are also appreciated.
Thank you!
(((((((Doingmybest)))))))
We moved to a rural area about ten years ago. Before that I had a very busy work and social life and although I loved the change in circumstances on many levels I did find that I felt lonely a lot of the time. A very new feeling for me! Rather than feeling isolated I decided that I needed people and to do things that I enjoy so I reach out as much as I can - for interaction and for experiences. I could do with your skills in furniture restoration by the way!
When my husband stopped drinking I imagined that we would get back to being open, being good friends to each other etc but that has taken a long time to happen. And I can not rely on just one person to fill my all needs for human contact anyway! Initially AH needed a lot of space, and then my own resentments got in the way. We are like two nervous wounded animals, wary of each other but wanting to be closer so we circle and try. Things work the best when we are each doing what pleases us as individuals - healing our own wounds.
I have noticed that the months following the two year mark have been much easier. As you say balance is, I think, an ever evolving lesson!
Coping when a life threatening disease looms must be quite frightening for both of you - it is such a powerful reminder to make the most of our days and easily brings up feelings of abandonment as well I imagine. Being able to ask for a gentle stroke or a soft kiss, feeling heard, is important to all of us at times like this. And I'm pretty certain that my husband would be completely flummoxed and conflicted about 'how to fix this.' and 'what about me' and 'I feel guilty about.' and I would just want to say to him 'however much time we have left, can we simply enjoy it and create good memories together' and then I would trip myself up by being nervous of saying that because of past hurts! Now look at me projecting. I am sorry! I'm leaving that bit in just in case it helps you to know that other people worry and and then I usually get in my own way! I wonder if there are classes or meetings in town for you, or perhaps a spa - you could hitch a ride with your husband from time to time!!
I'm smiling at the thought of seeing Alaska in June. It is a dream of mine - wow! Those long daylight hours and stunningly beautiful landscapes!!!
Sending gentle ((((hugs))))
-- Edited by milkwood on Sunday 7th of August 2016 01:16:56 AM
Thank you milkwood so very much. It feels like you "get" it and that means a lot. I completely understand the connection with others and I do try, but to be completely honest, I'm not really good with large groups...not because I don't enjoy other people, but because I don't like the loud, abrasive noises of people without good manners. I love to spend time with people who don't scream and yell or don't "slam" everybody they see. Otherwise, I'm honestly happier alone.
I was always in the "top of my class" and had a lots of friends growing up and I had lots of quasi-friends when working (20 years before I had to medically retire). I am well educated and enjoy talking with others on a wide variety of subjects. As much as I thought I would hate a cruise, I found it to be very enjoyable (most of the time), much more so than the trip to Maui because we were too close to too many people too much of the time. Peace and quiet are very important to me( and to my family). We simply enjoy the relaxation of the cruise and the companionship of very enjoyable people from so many other places.
You really hit the nail on the head with the spa thing because my daughter and I came accross an amazing deal (1/2 price minus $40.00) on an inflatable hot tub/spa. After an online review/comparison, we ended up paying about $190.00 for an Intex 6 person spa with all the bells and whistles. We even set it up in a flash earlier this week. Hubby tried it out yesterday for the first time. I added aroma therapy/muscle relaxing detox solution from the pool/spa store And it was amazing!
To my great surprise, he loves it! He pulled me against him, hugged me, and played the whole time. I commented that this was what I meant by snuggling and he outright asked if this would meet the snuggling "requirement" (not negative). He went on to say that snuggling in the bed is just too hard because of all of the pillows (I have to have them), his machine (CPaP), and the dogs (two Pomeranians). Despite our giant bed, it is still just complicated.
The point is that I was misreading the issue. He does want to be close (it is physical touch I miss so much), but doesn't want to hurt me physically.
I think I felt a thousand pounds lift.
I agree that one person can never make you happy or meet all of your needs and I don't want any person to be the whole of my life, but I do want that feeling of personal loving touch just for a while. Otherwise, I enjoy hobbies: taking something (furniture, decor, left over tiles...what have you) and making them in to lovely restorations to enjoy. I don't like clutter and can get too many, so I sell them at consignment or give them away, but I enjoy the process and the stress outlet. I just have to pace myself and not overdo it.
I just wanted you (and my other responders) to know how much I appreciate your communication and understanding. I may have passed the worst of the daily hell of alcoholism (for a while...or just for today), but I still have a great deal of work to do. I'm actively seeking a sponsor and have put out feelers. I'm hoping to find someone soon who will understand and work well with me and someone who will call it like it is. I feel I need to work the steps (4-12) to really be where I want to be. I have tried, but you really need someone to lead you through these.
Wish me luck in finding the right person...perhaps even this week at the meeting.
I was fortunate that the channels of communication never closed for us while he was actively using. I have the ability to say "I have been feeling kind of needy/anxious/angry do you think we can ____________________ today." Usually he is happy to oblige and I have never felt rejected afterwards. If anything I have found it prevents the feeling of resentment because there is no misunderstanding between us. Healthy expectations is a concept that has really changed our marriage and its something that we try and establish constantly.
Serious medical issues are nothing to down play. There is a heavy emotional burden that is placed on the patients shoulders as well as their loved ones. The waiting can be incredibly painful and causes a sense of grief. I recently found a program called Betterhelp (you can try free for 7 days) where you answer a range of questions and it then pairs you with you a therapist online. They are fully licensed and mine so far has been incredibly helpful. Mine specialized in family, marriage and addiction counseling so they are very knowledgeable with AA and Al Anon. I am able to send her messages on a private board like this one that only her and I can see and then she responds usually with in an hour or so. You can also arrange skype or appointments if that is easier. Another idea is to speak to your doctor there may be forums such as this that can offer support.
Good luck ((hugs))