OK for those of you who are used to my warped sense of humor, I maybe have sucked you in w/ the Topic. For the rest of ya, I may have sucked you in w/ the Topic. ;)
I'm not quite sure how to describe my program right now. I don't know whether I'm allowing my A to push my buttons and I've come to a screeching halt, or I dunno if I'm spinning my wheels trying to fight these slips.
Either way, I'm burning rubber, it's smokey and it stinks.
I find myself getting angry to the point where I'm raising my voice more often. I think I'm building to my resentment pile again. Things I had virtually stopped doing. Or at least when I did do them, I didn't repeat them as soon. Hell tonight I even told my A to F* off, gave her and 'up yours' gesture and called her another name on the way out that I think I do not use.
And it all started over stupid crap. She is drinking by 3, can't pick up my son from the bus stop, can't take my daughter to a friends. Makes no attempt to do any dishes or anything. I make a simple soup and sandwich. I've done dishes, made two different sandwiches (tuna and grilled cheese) and made her a can of soup. She also likes onions on her sandwich so I slice some up. I tell her everything is ready for her to make her sandwich. "What? You can't make it for me?" Well. NO. I'm not in the mood to play Goldilocks, this sandwich is too much mayo, this one doesn't have enough onions, this one has too much tuna.
Well I blew a gasket. Like I don't do enough. She then says something to me about yelling where the kids can hear it. Again I ask her what about in a drunken stupor calling 2 kids out of 3 kids over individually to tell them you were moving out cause of dad, and telliing the other one to go away). Sure I make mistakes but they are heat of the moment screw ups, not premidated conscience involvement of the kids to try to manipulate the situation to my own purpose. She said something about me hurting her feelings about a gift she bought me (long story, worthy of seperate post and I shared about in chat) and I asked what about my feelings my feelings have been hurt over and over.
Her reply was that was impossible, my feelings can't be hurt.
Was this the assinine rant of an alcoholic? Does she really believe this? Have I stuffed my feelings so often to the point of volcanic activity and tectonic shifting she can really believe this? Any time I've ever cried in front of her I've gotten yelled at. Is that because she can't cry or that because I'm supposed to be emotionally fridgid? Heck one time my best friends, (best man and groom) paid for my hotel room for the wedding before I checked out because they knew I was struggling. I broke down in the parking lot and was yelled at for it. Tangent but an example.
Maybe I'm just allowing my focus to shift to her. I know I'm allowing her to get me going. Maybe I'm pissed off at myself for allowing some boundries to be crossed and not having some in others. Maybe it's not enough time to meditate and pray. Even when I pray, my mind races and I lose focus, which is frustrating me too.
Ugh. I think there are alot of things. I think I need one hour at a time right now and I have to remember to ask my HP for help, cause my best ain't cutting it right now.
Thanks
Bob
Jeannie said
Jan 9, 2006
(((((((((((Bob)))))))))))
You have a lot on your plate right now and it is hard.
Does she mean it? When they are drinking who knows what they mean, definatley not them. Not to brush it off, but it doesn't matter, it is the disease talking. You can't please an A, it is always too much or not enough.
It is so hard to not enable when there are kids involved, they have to be taken care of and someone has to do it, that means us. that isn't enabling, it is taking care of the responsibiolities of the family. It gets so frustrating we can't help feel that how much more are we expected to do. The awful part is the A will not see it no matter what we do.
Give yourslef some TLC, and take the focus off of her and put it on you. You know the answers you just need to put them in place. I think we all spin our wheels at times. Take a deep breath and be good to yourself.
Love jeannie
sas said
Jan 9, 2006
bobump,
Wow, does this ever bring me back. There was a time not so long ago that I truly didn't care about what happened to my husband. His using was causing a mountain of upset in the family and he had turned into the biggest a-hole on the planet. I really hated him. I didn't think that after he went through 3 mo. of treatment that he would behave any differently. I wasn't ready to believe that he could be a good man. It had to be proven to me. I wanted to know how much of his behavior was the drugs and how much was just the man. Maybe he really is the worlds biggest a-hole and the drugs had nothing to do with it.
I wasn't so fortunate to find al anon during the active days of his drug use. I was to afraid and embarrassed to reach out for help. I tolerated alot and for what? I don't know exactly, but I believe it was to finally lead me to the program of al anon and for him to find AA.
We are in a very good place right now and it is only with the help of AA and Al Anon. These programs have helped thousands and thousands of people. I have seen it's work and am a believer in the success of them. For us it works. I am not a senior member of al anon. I am just beginning to seriously work the program, but i think i have some experience with the before and after of life with an A and I can say that my husband is not the world's biggest a-hole. Some of the earlier behaviors are still present, but they are very different and I would say without a doubt the drug that our A's use cause them to behave in horrible ways. I don't think I am telling you anyting you don't already know. I have read many of your posts and you sound to me like you are handling things very well. I hope to do as well as you someday. I have alot of work to do, but I want to have what I see/hear in many of you in the program.
All I really wanted to stress is that in my case it most certainly was the drugs doing the talking. They ruled our house and we let it happen. I am so glad there IS another way.
Another something I wanted to mention, I read another of your posts, you mentioned the lack of men in al anon. I have a friend who feels the same as well. I did tell him about this website. I hope he gives it a try. I know it feels even better to find someone you can relate to in all ways, but I almsot always find something I relate to in just about everyone I have heard from in al anon!
Thanks for this,
Michelle
AlaMom said
Jan 9, 2006
(((((Bob)))))
you so sucked me in with the topic but oh wow did I need to see what you wrote. So much of it I can identify with over the last month. Some of the possibilites you brought up I hadnt thought of - and now have avenues to explore.
Thanx
Karen
Jule_cat21 said
Jan 9, 2006
(((BOB))))
I agree with Jeannie's post - it's the disease talking and yes, it's just like goldilocks over and over. Big hugs. Hang in there. You are aware and you are trying and not stuffing it down, and that is the best that anyone can do in the situation. Don't be so hard on yourself.
Jule
canadianguy said
Jan 9, 2006
Bob.... what is that age-old definition of insanity?? when we do something the same way, over and over again, and somehow expect a different result?? Hmmm.... I'll leave the rest up to you, lol...
When I read your post, I kept reading a whole bunch of "why" questions, either directly or inferred... It took me MANY years and MANY counselors, but I finally 'saw the light', from my sponsor, that when we are living with active alcoholism, we need (for our own sanity) to focus on the "whats" and not the "whys". She is what she is - a sick, scared, addict. She will act out on anything and everything that keeps others from her, so she can wallow in her addiction... When she thinks she's pushed you and others too far, she'll be good as gold, for awhile, to draw you back in..... and so on, and so on, goes the vicious circle.
Two thoughts come to mind.... My sponsor used to remind me to think of my wife, when she was active, as having a big stamp on her forehead saying "sick, sick, sick". This actually helped me remember, and to stop expecting an insane and irrational person to act in a sane and rational manner. The other thought, I had to come up with all by myself, was that as long as I was choosing to stay in my heartless, loveless, agonizing marriage - I slowly began to erode my "right" to get pity for it, as it was becoming MY decision. I say this, not to make any judgement or opinion as to what you should do, or what is right for you (as of course, I have no idea), but just one of those 'reflection moments', where, as cold as it sounds - one has to wonder "and just what did you expect an insane, irrational, angry alcoholic to act like?"
Hopefully food for thought...
Take care
Tom
bobump said
Jan 10, 2006
canadianguy wrote: Bob.... what is that age-old definition of insanity?? when we do something the same way, over and over again, and somehow expect a different result?? Hmmm.... I'll leave the rest up to you, lol...
CG, you mean kinda like my signature? lol
maresie said
Jan 10, 2006
Oh Bob I feel for you. As I sit here the cat is yowling at my boyfriend's insanity. He is speaking to one of his creditors on the phone and there is all this justification and pathos and more. I am for once not interrupting, helping, rescuing doing anything but taking care of me.
I do know that I need what I have heard you call periodic maintenace. For me to do anything I have to really monitor and take care of my resentment. If I get into that toxic level no matter how justified it is (and of course it is justified since I am living with insanity), I have to detox.
What do you have to detox with. I know you have this room. I know you have other sources and must no doubt love and cherish your children. I hope you are able to do as much as possible for yourself in detoxing. I have had to detox first before I can think long term short term any other way. I have found that so so essential.
I hope you can get some respite. If your wife is not eating don't feed her. Just let her be. Remember the al-anon promise of just doing what you need to do today if she is not in a life threatening position then don't feed her, water her or do any of those things. You need to take care of you too and I know how toxic caretaking others can be for me. I am so burned out from doing that and I am truly a very very caring person.
I am so glad that you can come here and tell your truth and feel safe to do so. I am very very glad that I found this space and know it has already brought a lot of comfort and structure in my life. I hope you can make other resources for yourself and take yourself to a place where you feel less burned and less exhausted.
OK for those of you who are used to my warped sense of humor, I maybe have sucked you in w/ the Topic. For the rest of ya, I may have sucked you in w/ the Topic. ;)
I'm not quite sure how to describe my program right now. I don't know whether I'm allowing my A to push my buttons and I've come to a screeching halt, or I dunno if I'm spinning my wheels trying to fight these slips.
Either way, I'm burning rubber, it's smokey and it stinks.
I find myself getting angry to the point where I'm raising my voice more often. I think I'm building to my resentment pile again. Things I had virtually stopped doing. Or at least when I did do them, I didn't repeat them as soon. Hell tonight I even told my A to F* off, gave her and 'up yours' gesture and called her another name on the way out that I think I do not use.
And it all started over stupid crap. She is drinking by 3, can't pick up my son from the bus stop, can't take my daughter to a friends. Makes no attempt to do any dishes or anything. I make a simple soup and sandwich. I've done dishes, made two different sandwiches (tuna and grilled cheese) and made her a can of soup. She also likes onions on her sandwich so I slice some up. I tell her everything is ready for her to make her sandwich. "What? You can't make it for me?" Well. NO. I'm not in the mood to play Goldilocks, this sandwich is too much mayo, this one doesn't have enough onions, this one has too much tuna.
Well I blew a gasket. Like I don't do enough. She then says something to me about yelling where the kids can hear it. Again I ask her what about in a drunken stupor calling 2 kids out of 3 kids over individually to tell them you were moving out cause of dad, and telliing the other one to go away). Sure I make mistakes but they are heat of the moment screw ups, not premidated conscience involvement of the kids to try to manipulate the situation to my own purpose. She said something about me hurting her feelings about a gift she bought me (long story, worthy of seperate post and I shared about in chat) and I asked what about my feelings my feelings have been hurt over and over.
Her reply was that was impossible, my feelings can't be hurt.
Was this the assinine rant of an alcoholic? Does she really believe this? Have I stuffed my feelings so often to the point of volcanic activity and tectonic shifting she can really believe this? Any time I've ever cried in front of her I've gotten yelled at. Is that because she can't cry or that because I'm supposed to be emotionally fridgid? Heck one time my best friends, (best man and groom) paid for my hotel room for the wedding before I checked out because they knew I was struggling. I broke down in the parking lot and was yelled at for it. Tangent but an example.
Maybe I'm just allowing my focus to shift to her. I know I'm allowing her to get me going. Maybe I'm pissed off at myself for allowing some boundries to be crossed and not having some in others. Maybe it's not enough time to meditate and pray. Even when I pray, my mind races and I lose focus, which is frustrating me too.
Ugh. I think there are alot of things. I think I need one hour at a time right now and I have to remember to ask my HP for help, cause my best ain't cutting it right now.
Thanks
Bob
(((((((((((Bob)))))))))))
You have a lot on your plate right now and it is hard.
Does she mean it? When they are drinking who knows what they mean, definatley not them. Not to brush it off, but it doesn't matter, it is the disease talking. You can't please an A, it is always too much or not enough.
It is so hard to not enable when there are kids involved, they have to be taken care of and someone has to do it, that means us. that isn't enabling, it is taking care of the responsibiolities of the family. It gets so frustrating we can't help feel that how much more are we expected to do. The awful part is the A will not see it no matter what we do.
Give yourslef some TLC, and take the focus off of her and put it on you. You know the answers you just need to put them in place. I think we all spin our wheels at times. Take a deep breath and be good to yourself.
Love jeannie
bobump,
Wow, does this ever bring me back. There was a time not so long ago that I truly didn't care about what happened to my husband. His using was causing a mountain of upset in the family and he had turned into the biggest a-hole on the planet. I really hated him. I didn't think that after he went through 3 mo. of treatment that he would behave any differently. I wasn't ready to believe that he could be a good man. It had to be proven to me. I wanted to know how much of his behavior was the drugs and how much was just the man. Maybe he really is the worlds biggest a-hole and the drugs had nothing to do with it.
I wasn't so fortunate to find al anon during the active days of his drug use. I was to afraid and embarrassed to reach out for help. I tolerated alot and for what? I don't know exactly, but I believe it was to finally lead me to the program of al anon and for him to find AA.
We are in a very good place right now and it is only with the help of AA and Al Anon. These programs have helped thousands and thousands of people. I have seen it's work and am a believer in the success of them. For us it works. I am not a senior member of al anon. I am just beginning to seriously work the program, but i think i have some experience with the before and after of life with an A and I can say that my husband is not the world's biggest a-hole. Some of the earlier behaviors are still present, but they are very different and I would say without a doubt the drug that our A's use cause them to behave in horrible ways. I don't think I am telling you anyting you don't already know. I have read many of your posts and you sound to me like you are handling things very well. I hope to do as well as you someday. I have alot of work to do, but I want to have what I see/hear in many of you in the program.
All I really wanted to stress is that in my case it most certainly was the drugs doing the talking. They ruled our house and we let it happen. I am so glad there IS another way.
Another something I wanted to mention, I read another of your posts, you mentioned the lack of men in al anon. I have a friend who feels the same as well. I did tell him about this website. I hope he gives it a try. I know it feels even better to find someone you can relate to in all ways, but I almsot always find something I relate to in just about everyone I have heard from in al anon!
Thanks for this,
Michelle
(((((Bob)))))
you so sucked me in with the topic but oh wow did I need to see what you wrote. So much of it I can identify with over the last month. Some of the possibilites you brought up I hadnt thought of - and now have avenues to explore.
Thanx
Karen
(((BOB))))
I agree with Jeannie's post - it's the disease talking and yes, it's just like goldilocks over and over. Big hugs. Hang in there. You are aware and you are trying and not stuffing it down, and that is the best that anyone can do in the situation. Don't be so hard on yourself.
Jule
Bob.... what is that age-old definition of insanity?? when we do something the same way, over and over again, and somehow expect a different result?? Hmmm.... I'll leave the rest up to you, lol...
When I read your post, I kept reading a whole bunch of "why" questions, either directly or inferred... It took me MANY years and MANY counselors, but I finally 'saw the light', from my sponsor, that when we are living with active alcoholism, we need (for our own sanity) to focus on the "whats" and not the "whys". She is what she is - a sick, scared, addict. She will act out on anything and everything that keeps others from her, so she can wallow in her addiction... When she thinks she's pushed you and others too far, she'll be good as gold, for awhile, to draw you back in..... and so on, and so on, goes the vicious circle.
Two thoughts come to mind.... My sponsor used to remind me to think of my wife, when she was active, as having a big stamp on her forehead saying "sick, sick, sick". This actually helped me remember, and to stop expecting an insane and irrational person to act in a sane and rational manner. The other thought, I had to come up with all by myself, was that as long as I was choosing to stay in my heartless, loveless, agonizing marriage - I slowly began to erode my "right" to get pity for it, as it was becoming MY decision. I say this, not to make any judgement or opinion as to what you should do, or what is right for you (as of course, I have no idea), but just one of those 'reflection moments', where, as cold as it sounds - one has to wonder "and just what did you expect an insane, irrational, angry alcoholic to act like?"
Hopefully food for thought...
Take care
Tom
CG, you mean kinda like my signature? lol
Oh Bob I feel for you. As I sit here the cat is yowling at my boyfriend's insanity. He is speaking to one of his creditors on the phone and there is all this justification and pathos and more. I am for once not interrupting, helping, rescuing doing anything but taking care of me.
I do know that I need what I have heard you call periodic maintenace. For me to do anything I have to really monitor and take care of my resentment. If I get into that toxic level no matter how justified it is (and of course it is justified since I am living with insanity), I have to detox.
What do you have to detox with. I know you have this room. I know you have other sources and must no doubt love and cherish your children. I hope you are able to do as much as possible for yourself in detoxing. I have had to detox first before I can think long term short term any other way. I have found that so so essential.
I hope you can get some respite. If your wife is not eating don't feed her. Just let her be. Remember the al-anon promise of just doing what you need to do today if she is not in a life threatening position then don't feed her, water her or do any of those things. You need to take care of you too and I know how toxic caretaking others can be for me. I am so burned out from doing that and I am truly a very very caring person.
I am so glad that you can come here and tell your truth and feel safe to do so. I am very very glad that I found this space and know it has already brought a lot of comfort and structure in my life. I hope you can make other resources for yourself and take yourself to a place where you feel less burned and less exhausted.
Maresie.