"We eventually redefine our beliefs and understanding to the point where we see that our greatest need is for knowledge of God's will for us and the strength to carry that out"Basic Text p. 46When we first arrived in NA, we had all kinds of ideas of what we needed. Some of us set our sights on amassing personal possessions. We thought recovery equaled outward success. But recovery does not equal success. Today, we believe that our greatest need is for spiritual guidance and strength.The greatest damage done to us by our addiction was the damage done to our spirituality. Our primary motivation was dictated by our disease: to get, to use, and to find ways and means to get more. Enslaved by our overwhelming need for drugs, our lives lacked purpose and connection. We were spiritually bankrupt.
>>>>>rosie >>>> that word----" god's will still for me" still triggers....even tho my head tells me that god did NOT plan/ will incest and abuse to me....it happened!!! and god did not rescue me....god did not interfer, and i died inch by inch....i know, in my thinking mind, that this was NOT part of the plan/ promise/ wish for me by my higher power, but this is what i got!!!.....AND when i prayed, i got NO rescue.......so "god's will for me" brings up scary connotations...like "oh my, what ELSE does this god want to test me with" so i have dificulty with "god's will for me"......i am confused ...i want to trust/ believe in the GOODNESS of god, that god would NOT want destruction and evil and despair brought onto any child.....but i can only feel what i experienced......its hard for me to get past god's NOT rescueing me....the fact that he/she/it did NOT interfer....so in my child mind, i ask "was something so horrible as that in his/her/its PLAN for me????".....and if so, can i afford to seek another "god's will for me"???
>>>>.rosie....it is like a war between my inner child and my adult mind.....like "oh no , we couldn't not survive anohter of his/her/its will for us"......OR is it god's will that i heal and find a life......was his/her/its will interrupted by the evil??? i talked with my beloved cousin and she was telling me that she could see why i couldn't get past the "why didn't i get help when i was being killed???".....but its not just me, its all OVER.....so for me it is hard to want to ask for something's will but i am going to ACT AS IF....god did NOT want that for me...that he/she/it wanted to STOP it...but couldn't interfer in this "natural law" catastrophy becuz we are under free will and choice and the "source's" hands were tied..just like when other bad people do evil things, god has to allow the free will/ choice rule to prevail......
>>>>>rosie>>so this am in my truck, i very nervously asked my higher power to for this new year AS i implement and practice my new and healthy things i learned in this program.....i asked for TWO things, as i do my work...for my Higher power to a.....help me find the me that was original...the REAL me, imperfect and all, but me........and b.....help me find and LIVE and experience the plan that was SUPPOSED to be for me...the original divine plan for my life......
>>>>>rosie...i was a bit nervous, but i told my hp, that i was , even tho it was hard, i was WILLING to trust/love this hp....that i was willing to forgive the fact that noone supposedly close to me did a THING to help me during my desperate years, and lets "begin again"....that i was TIRED of being mad/angry at having to endure and "get through" it on my own.........i will never understand why so much suffering and evil is allowed here, but i am not going to struggle with trying to figure it out anymore....i just want to FIND ME.....and find the REAL life i was meant to live......i cannot give me back what was stolen, but perhaps i can build whats left of my life starting today ONE DAY AT A TIME!!!!!
Sooner or later, we realize that our greatest need in recovery is "for knowledge of God's will for us and the strength to carry that out:' There, we find the direction and sense of purpose our addiction had hidden from us. In our God's will we find freedom from self-will. No longer driven only by our own needs, we are free to live with others on an equal footing.There's nothing wrong with outward success. But without the spiritual connection offered by the NA program, our greatest need in recovery goes unmet, regardless of how "successful" we may be.Just for today: I will seek the fulfillment of my greatest need: a vital, guiding connection with the God of my understanding.
>>>>rosie>>> like i said "god's will" for me scares me...i could NOT survive another catastrophy like that...it damned near killed me and that is the truth...getting honest with my hp, and my fellow recovery mates has always been my theme...whether people agree with me or not, i am me with my own feelings.....i had a DUEL catastrophy...not only did i suffer CHRONIC loss as an acoa with the usual emotional abuse/ loss/ dysfunction ...but i also suffered the destruction of my own mind/emotions/and to a big degree my soul with the incest as well...its like what teeny tentative shreds of life/ sanity/safety/hope i clung to were ripped away from me when he began the ultimate betrayal...........i had a DOUBLE hit!!!! i told my cousin there must be SOME reason why i survived this double disaster.....with NO help/ support/ safe place to go to on TOP of it!!!! no WONDER i am having such a dificult time recovering.....
>>>>>>>> so was it god's will i be hear???and if so, was it for to help me achieve SOME kind of life before the end comes????? must be...otherwise WHY would i be here, busting my guts working on this recovery......many times i wanted to quit and medicate...just numb out till i "went home" but something inside of me won't LET me quit!!!! at 59-1/2 i keep saying what is the POINT???? but something refuses to let me quit this and just get anesthetized and fantasize and just "cop out" and wait for the end.......no, something is pushing me along this HARD, heartbreaking walking through this horrible pain journey.......i quit saying that the "light at the end of the tunnel is near" i don't want to have unrealistic expectations...i am keeping it VERY simple....basic as i can be, so i am NOT setting myself up for disappointment.......
>>>>rosie...as i enter year 3 of my recovery....all i say is "lead me to ME....lead me to the life i was SUPPOSED to MEANT to have....its gotta be better than the one i have endured all these years".....hard as it is for me to get "past" all the times my hp could have stepped in and saved me (all the people who wanted to adopt me and get me out of that hell hole and god didn't take advantage of those opportunities HANDED to him/her/it.....than there is the recovery work....the cost to me financially/ relationships/ etc.....i have a lot to "get past" in forgiving this...but i CHOOSE to becuz it takes the focus off taking care of me.....so , i nervously seek god's will for me, even tho the track record for most of my life hasn't been so great!!!!!
krise said
Jan 3, 2006
Rosie:
Thank you for sharing. It still amazes me when I hear someone's story and it sounds so similar to my own. When you grow up in dysfunction and abuse, the worst part is feeling so alone and so dirty. To know that there are other survivors brings hope to me.
I too was sexually abused when I was very young. I held onto the pain and hurt for so many years, probably 20 or more. I did not find relief until in prayer I told God that I was mad at Him for letting that happen to me. I got truly honest with how I felt and expressed it to Him . . . and lightning didn't strike me. The answer I got was, "one man may have hurt you, but I sent one Man to save you."
It didn't erase what happened, but like you were saying, we live in an evil, fallen world where there is free will. I don't understand the whole picture, but I know God is on my side, and in the scheme of all eternity, I know all those who have suffered abuse will be finally completely healed of all their pain . . . it will be wiped away. For now, I guess we use that suffering to learn more about God. And I agree with you, it is scary. Just when I think I might have something figured out, everythings turns topsy turvy. We who have suffered abuse I think survived by fantasizing about some kind of utopia . . . some perfect relationship, some perfect life . . . unfortunately that doesn't exist and only brings on more heartache.
That's what I have enjoyed about being here . . the real-ness of lives . . . nothing perfect, just people seeking God . . that's all we can do.
Love you as a sister in our shared hurts and recovery,
krise
kitty said
Jan 3, 2006
"so , i nervously seek god's will for me, even tho the track record for most of my life hasn't been so great!!!!!"
(((( Rosie )))) many cyber hugs to you dear heart ~
Thank you for your gut wrenchingly honest post. Your posts touch me often, I am sorry I don't respond much but I do want you to know you are very appreciated.
What you are doing takes great courage, I encourage you, support you, love you. Looks like you are taking very brave steps into the unknown, it is inspiring, thank you for sharing.
with love, -K
Jerry F said
Jan 3, 2006
Rosie it maybe a bit risky as a man offering you some comfort. You might not have the trust necessary to hear it from a brother in recovery and your fear might be so great that you discount what is being offered.
I remember the abuse and fear of more abuse. I remember the thoughts that, "Surely I must deserve this for some reason." I remember the depression, rage, alcohol, money, sex, status, material things that I thought were the message that I was acceptable. I remember find out that I was wrong and that I was abusing my self too.
My resentments wouldn't let me rest until my sponsor taught me along with the program that I would have rest when I learned and practiced forgiveness and rest I do.
My anger drove me crazy and the people I loved left until my sponsor and the program showed me that the opposite of anger was acceptance and I got quiet inside and out.
My fear could be heard, felt, tasted and smelt until my sponsor and the program taught me that the opposite of fear is faith and I memorized the promises of recovery.
My Higher Power wouldn't listen to me until I opened my eyes and ears and accepted that I was missing more than what I needed and I learned that my HP doesn't hesitate to touch me with anything and everything within reach.
I asked my Higher Power if I was supposed to be in real-estate, NASA, home builder-designer, mortgage banker, pilot, business owner, etc etc and my Higher Power told me that I could choose anything that I wanted to do and that I had the ability to do it all (I have) but that what concerned my HP most was How I did what I chose to do and that was what HP's will for me was. I was to love my HP with my whole self just as my HP loved me and I was to love others and I myself desired to be love. This I was told was what HP's will for me was and that anything else was my own.
For the last 20 or so years of recovery I have tried to live this will and as a result I feel sane and spiritually serene. I feel at peace and as one with everything around me in spite of negative influences. The fear is gone.
(((((hugs)))))
rosie light shines said
Jan 3, 2006
hey jerry i think your post was great.....thank you for the post
all the books i read and even my sponser says that "forgiveness is a by product of healing" i don't hve to forgive my perp, god didn't.....but i DO and i AM forgiving me for my "so called part in it" which was being there......
yeah, its the fear thing opposite of faith that i need to work on....i think it will begin with me....AS i love and trust me, i think the hp thing will kinda work itself out becuz i am WILLING i say it all the time in my prayer/meditations...i am WILLING.....god/ source/ higher power is going to have to take it from there.....i heard that if one is willing , the universe can do something with it....one can hope.....becuz i am POWERLESS over this inability to put my trust in anything......that is so sad, the human beings, who were to be my protectors/ nurturers/ comforters, she was the enabler, he was my predator......i almost had NO chance to trust, but i am willing , but need help....
thanks for your insight.....and i get a LOT of good stuff from guys here.....2 years ago when i started, i may have been more afraid of guys, but i have an online sponser who is a guy and i love him to death!!!! my first sponser was a guy and we are still friends.......so sex means nothing to me...its the heart that counts.........hugs, back at ya, rosie
leo said
Jan 4, 2006
Rosie I have found myself questioning the road that HP has laid out for me also. I have not been violated like you and suffered the emotional/physical trauma but there have been many times in my life that I have questioned why are you testing me again. Particularly the loss of my father when I was 21 to cancer and my best friend who was my kindred spirit dying at 35 of the same disease. She left behind a 7 and 9 year old child. I think sometimes we underestimate the times that Hp is there for us that we don't recognize. I have only found HP through this program and I think the poem about the footprints in the sand when there is only one set of prints and Hp lifts up when we aren't aware of it says it all. Hope this helps . Hugs luv ya. Leo x
Our Greatest Need
"We eventually redefine our beliefs and understanding to the point where we see that our greatest need is for knowledge of God's will for us and the strength to carry that out"Basic Text p. 46When we first arrived in NA, we had all kinds of ideas of what we needed. Some of us set our sights on amassing personal possessions. We thought recovery equaled outward success. But recovery does not equal success. Today, we believe that our greatest need is for spiritual guidance and strength.The greatest damage done to us by our addiction was the damage done to our spirituality. Our primary motivation was dictated by our disease: to get, to use, and to find ways and means to get more. Enslaved by our overwhelming need for drugs, our lives lacked purpose and connection. We were spiritually bankrupt.
>>>>>rosie >>>> that word----" god's will still for me" still triggers....even tho my head tells me that god did NOT plan/ will incest and abuse to me....it happened!!! and god did not rescue me....god did not interfer, and i died inch by inch....i know, in my thinking mind, that this was NOT part of the plan/ promise/ wish for me by my higher power, but this is what i got!!!.....AND when i prayed, i got NO rescue.......so "god's will for me" brings up scary connotations...like "oh my, what ELSE does this god want to test me with" so i have dificulty with "god's will for me"......i am confused ...i want to trust/ believe in the GOODNESS of god, that god would NOT want destruction and evil and despair brought onto any child.....but i can only feel what i experienced......its hard for me to get past god's NOT rescueing me....the fact that he/she/it did NOT interfer....so in my child mind, i ask "was something so horrible as that in his/her/its PLAN for me????".....and if so, can i afford to seek another "god's will for me"???
>>>>.rosie....it is like a war between my inner child and my adult mind.....like "oh no , we couldn't not survive anohter of his/her/its will for us"......OR is it god's will that i heal and find a life......was his/her/its will interrupted by the evil??? i talked with my beloved cousin and she was telling me that she could see why i couldn't get past the "why didn't i get help when i was being killed???".....but its not just me, its all OVER.....so for me it is hard to want to ask for something's will but i am going to ACT AS IF....god did NOT want that for me...that he/she/it wanted to STOP it...but couldn't interfer in this "natural law" catastrophy becuz we are under free will and choice and the "source's" hands were tied..just like when other bad people do evil things, god has to allow the free will/ choice rule to prevail......
>>>>>rosie>>so this am in my truck, i very nervously asked my higher power to for this new year AS i implement and practice my new and healthy things i learned in this program.....i asked for TWO things, as i do my work...for my Higher power to a.....help me find the me that was original...the REAL me, imperfect and all, but me........and b.....help me find and LIVE and experience the plan that was SUPPOSED to be for me...the original divine plan for my life......
>>>>>rosie...i was a bit nervous, but i told my hp, that i was , even tho it was hard, i was WILLING to trust/love this hp....that i was willing to forgive the fact that noone supposedly close to me did a THING to help me during my desperate years, and lets "begin again"....that i was TIRED of being mad/angry at having to endure and "get through" it on my own.........i will never understand why so much suffering and evil is allowed here, but i am not going to struggle with trying to figure it out anymore....i just want to FIND ME.....and find the REAL life i was meant to live......i cannot give me back what was stolen, but perhaps i can build whats left of my life starting today ONE DAY AT A TIME!!!!!
Sooner or later, we realize that our greatest need in recovery is "for knowledge of God's will for us and the strength to carry that out:' There, we find the direction and sense of purpose our addiction had hidden from us. In our God's will we find freedom from self-will. No longer driven only by our own needs, we are free to live with others on an equal footing.There's nothing wrong with outward success. But without the spiritual connection offered by the NA program, our greatest need in recovery goes unmet, regardless of how "successful" we may be.Just for today: I will seek the fulfillment of my greatest need: a vital, guiding connection with the God of my understanding.
>>>>rosie>>> like i said "god's will" for me scares me...i could NOT survive another catastrophy like that...it damned near killed me and that is the truth...getting honest with my hp, and my fellow recovery mates has always been my theme...whether people agree with me or not, i am me with my own feelings.....i had a DUEL catastrophy...not only did i suffer CHRONIC loss as an acoa with the usual emotional abuse/ loss/ dysfunction ...but i also suffered the destruction of my own mind/emotions/and to a big degree my soul with the incest as well...its like what teeny tentative shreds of life/ sanity/safety/hope i clung to were ripped away from me when he began the ultimate betrayal...........i had a DOUBLE hit!!!! i told my cousin there must be SOME reason why i survived this double disaster.....with NO help/ support/ safe place to go to on TOP of it!!!! no WONDER i am having such a dificult time recovering.....
>>>>>>>> so was it god's will i be hear???and if so, was it for to help me achieve SOME kind of life before the end comes????? must be...otherwise WHY would i be here, busting my guts working on this recovery......many times i wanted to quit and medicate...just numb out till i "went home" but something inside of me won't LET me quit!!!! at 59-1/2 i keep saying what is the POINT???? but something refuses to let me quit this and just get anesthetized and fantasize and just "cop out" and wait for the end.......no, something is pushing me along this HARD, heartbreaking walking through this horrible pain journey.......i quit saying that the "light at the end of the tunnel is near" i don't want to have unrealistic expectations...i am keeping it VERY simple....basic as i can be, so i am NOT setting myself up for disappointment.......
>>>>rosie...as i enter year 3 of my recovery....all i say is "lead me to ME....lead me to the life i was SUPPOSED to MEANT to have....its gotta be better than the one i have endured all these years".....hard as it is for me to get "past" all the times my hp could have stepped in and saved me (all the people who wanted to adopt me and get me out of that hell hole and god didn't take advantage of those opportunities HANDED to him/her/it.....than there is the recovery work....the cost to me financially/ relationships/ etc.....i have a lot to "get past" in forgiving this...but i CHOOSE to becuz it takes the focus off taking care of me.....so , i nervously seek god's will for me, even tho the track record for most of my life hasn't been so great!!!!!
Rosie:
Thank you for sharing. It still amazes me when I hear someone's story and it sounds so similar to my own. When you grow up in dysfunction and abuse, the worst part is feeling so alone and so dirty. To know that there are other survivors brings hope to me.
I too was sexually abused when I was very young. I held onto the pain and hurt for so many years, probably 20 or more. I did not find relief until in prayer I told God that I was mad at Him for letting that happen to me. I got truly honest with how I felt and expressed it to Him . . . and lightning didn't strike me. The answer I got was, "one man may have hurt you, but I sent one Man to save you."
It didn't erase what happened, but like you were saying, we live in an evil, fallen world where there is free will. I don't understand the whole picture, but I know God is on my side, and in the scheme of all eternity, I know all those who have suffered abuse will be finally completely healed of all their pain . . . it will be wiped away. For now, I guess we use that suffering to learn more about God. And I agree with you, it is scary. Just when I think I might have something figured out, everythings turns topsy turvy. We who have suffered abuse I think survived by fantasizing about some kind of utopia . . . some perfect relationship, some perfect life . . . unfortunately that doesn't exist and only brings on more heartache.
That's what I have enjoyed about being here . . the real-ness of lives . . . nothing perfect, just people seeking God . . that's all we can do.
Love you as a sister in our shared hurts and recovery,
krise
"so , i nervously seek god's will for me, even tho the track record for most of my life hasn't been so great!!!!!"
(((( Rosie )))) many cyber hugs to you dear heart ~
Thank you for your gut wrenchingly honest post. Your posts touch me often, I am sorry I don't respond much but I do want you to know you are very appreciated.
What you are doing takes great courage, I encourage you, support you, love you. Looks like you are taking very brave steps into the unknown, it is inspiring, thank you for sharing.
with love, -K
Rosie it maybe a bit risky as a man offering you some comfort. You might not have the trust necessary to hear it from a brother in recovery and your fear might be so great that you discount what is being offered.
I remember the abuse and fear of more abuse. I remember the thoughts that, "Surely I must deserve this for some reason." I remember the depression, rage, alcohol, money, sex, status, material things that I thought were the message that I was acceptable. I remember find out that I was wrong and that I was abusing my self too.
My resentments wouldn't let me rest until my sponsor taught me along with the program that I would have rest when I learned and practiced forgiveness and rest I do.
My anger drove me crazy and the people I loved left until my sponsor and the program showed me that the opposite of anger was acceptance and I got quiet inside and out.
My fear could be heard, felt, tasted and smelt until my sponsor and the program taught me that the opposite of fear is faith and I memorized the promises of recovery.
My Higher Power wouldn't listen to me until I opened my eyes and ears and accepted that I was missing more than what I needed and I learned that my HP doesn't hesitate to touch me with anything and everything within reach.
I asked my Higher Power if I was supposed to be in real-estate, NASA, home builder-designer, mortgage banker, pilot, business owner, etc etc and my Higher Power told me that I could choose anything that I wanted to do and that I had the ability to do it all (I have) but that what concerned my HP most was How I did what I chose to do and that was what HP's will for me was. I was to love my HP with my whole self just as my HP loved me and I was to love others and I myself desired to be love. This I was told was what HP's will for me was and that anything else was my own.
For the last 20 or so years of recovery I have tried to live this will and as a result I feel sane and spiritually serene. I feel at peace and as one with everything around me in spite of negative influences. The fear is gone.
(((((hugs)))))
hey jerry i think your post was great.....thank you for the post
all the books i read and even my sponser says that "forgiveness is a by product of healing" i don't hve to forgive my perp, god didn't.....but i DO and i AM forgiving me for my "so called part in it" which was being there......
yeah, its the fear thing opposite of faith that i need to work on....i think it will begin with me....AS i love and trust me, i think the hp thing will kinda work itself out becuz i am WILLING i say it all the time in my prayer/meditations...i am WILLING.....god/ source/ higher power is going to have to take it from there.....i heard that if one is willing , the universe can do something with it....one can hope.....becuz i am POWERLESS over this inability to put my trust in anything......that is so sad, the human beings, who were to be my protectors/ nurturers/ comforters, she was the enabler, he was my predator......i almost had NO chance to trust, but i am willing , but need help....
thanks for your insight.....and i get a LOT of good stuff from guys here.....2 years ago when i started, i may have been more afraid of guys, but i have an online sponser who is a guy and i love him to death!!!! my first sponser was a guy and we are still friends.......so sex means nothing to me...its the heart that counts.........hugs, back at ya, rosie
Rosie I have found myself questioning the road that HP has laid out for me also. I have not been violated like you and suffered the emotional/physical trauma but there have been many times in my life that I have questioned why are you testing me again. Particularly the loss of my father when I was 21 to cancer and my best friend who was my kindred spirit dying at 35 of the same disease. She left behind a 7 and 9 year old child. I think sometimes we underestimate the times that Hp is there for us that we don't recognize. I have only found HP through this program and I think the poem about the footprints in the sand when there is only one set of prints and Hp lifts up when we aren't aware of it says it all. Hope this helps . Hugs luv ya. Leo x