I am drowning here. My husband stopped by to talk, even though I told him that I was exhausted. He told me that he just does not think he can do it without the boys and I. I have not asked that, just that he not be in the house. He said that when he went through his first divorce he contemplated suicide, knew how he would do it and still does. I explained to him that I have prayed an awful lot about this and even spoke to our pastor, that it would not be God's plan for this to happen. That I have lifted this up to my higher power but.... I am scared. The mind games are getting to me.... It is something different every time he speaks. I thought he had run out of things to say and do, but they just keep coming. When he left the house earlier today he had apparently removed his wedding band and colladagh and attached them to the pull chain on the ceiling fan in our room, I had not seen them there. When he came to talk, he removed them from the pull chain and put them back on, I did not even acknowledge what he had done. He asked me if he could have papers drawn up to sign the house and his car over to me if he picks up again, I said you can do that, but how would that benefit you? I have heard so many things in the last twenty four hours, my head is spinning, my stomach kills and I feel as insane as I did before. I know I am doing the right thing but am having a really hard time with the whole suicide thing. I do not want to lose him that way, I do not want my children to go through that. I do not know what to do....
notsonew1111 said
Dec 28, 2005
(((lynn)))) i know how you feel because my a has too threatened suicide. what you can do is call a suicide hotline to learn about it. i have alot of knowledge on the topic and am aware what to look for if someone is likely to do it. this could be very beneficial to you and give you someone to talk to. tc
leo said
Dec 28, 2005
Keep speaking to your pastor and if you have a sponsor keep in touch with them. Remember you cannot control any of his actions. As sad as it sounds you cannot be his keeper 24 hours a day. The only thing I can suggest is to let him know that he is still a part of your life but because of the effect he has on you and the children he needs to live somewhere else. Please keep the focus on your own well being. The addiction has caused these circumstances not you or the kids remember that. Here for you. Keep posting. Hugs and sorry I am so far away. Luv Leo xx
-- Edited by leo at 23:33, 2005-12-28
kitty said
Dec 28, 2005
Dear Confused,
This sounds like a plea for attention or maybe not, I don't know you or your A, obviously. I do know you are supposed to take these comments seriously.
I have tried suicide twice, it is by the grace of God alone that I am still here. I would vent, I wasn't living & I was in great pain both emotionally & physically. I thought about "escaping" every other day for 20 years as I lived in a depressed & hopeless state. I didn't know how to love myself... I loved everyone but me.
I am getting better. I just wanted to say maybe you ought to talk to ppl that specialize in this, it is hard when you're dealing with an "A" you just don't know if it is manipulation or what. I never had plans but I did act out & try to OD last year. No one can stop someone or protect someone. He may very well need clinical help. When I was 15 & tried to kill myself then, I was immediately put into an institution. Most kids there stayed a year, my 4 month stay, was very short in comparison. But I wanted help & I received it.
I think getting the possesions in your name is very wise. My mother did the same thing a few months ago when all hell broke loose w/ my step-father -- got caught cheatting, admitting to a double life for 15 years, gambling, cheatting & drinking 9 hours a day, as he admitted. Dunno it might be much worse, can't trust what an addict says when they are backed into a corner, they only tell you half of the truth at best @ least this is what other addicts in recovery told me.
But she didn't want him to gamble our lives away, so the will has been reworked, everything is now in my mother's name. It is sad the lengths that they will go to to keep their secrets, that is what hides their shame & keeps the cycle of denial for them going.
It is hard to watch someone you love suffer... focus on your boys and YOURSELF. No one can be helped unless they themselves want to change. Some never do.
You can control yourself, change yourself & cure yourself. Having that is big. Other ppl will do what they will do ~ no matter what you do. Focus on you & loving yourself, hang in there.
your sis in recovery, -K
horselover58 said
Dec 28, 2005
Confused,
I just read your post. It's sounds like a lot to digest! I agree with you, sounds like mind games. The suicide ideation is not good. He was divorced once before & that was when he felt suicidal & had a plan? Did he tell you what it is?
My experience is personal. I was suicidal myself, many years ago. I was in my late teens early 20's. I had a baby out of wedlock @ age 20, had very caring parents, but was very depressed. I threatened suicide. What I really wanted was help! I realize now that suicide is a selfish act. I couldn't leave my little baby behind. What would that do to him? I am 47 now & he is 27.
My life is pretty good now thanks to Alanon, it was rough for more years then not. I'm married to an active alcoholic, in denial. Came close to divorce last year. I hit bottom, felt like taking my life again. But all I really needed was a chance. I've been more faithfully working the program. That has been a blessing. I am now even grateful for marrying an alcoholic, if I didn't, i don't think I would have gotten the hepl I so desperatley needed.
I hope I was of some help.
Deb
BlueCloud said
Dec 29, 2005
((((((Confused))))))),
I don't have experience with this as a spouse, but as a kid, when my mother decided to leave my A father, he did much the same thing. He threatened to commit suicide or to hurt her. He brought clergy to the home to telll her divorce was wrong. He got ill. He got angry. He got nice. He pleaded. He tried to manipulate us kids. My mom told me much later, when I was grown, that a woman she went to Alanon with, told her that my father may try these types of manipulations and he did to a "T," (LOL), so my mom was ready for the manipulation. I think that this type of behavior may be par for the course with some As.
Luckily, my father never followed through with the threats. However, to maintain all of our sanities, my mother cut contact with him. Hopefully, you won't need to go to that extreme of a measure here, but you have a right to enforce boundaries to take care of YOU and the kids. When someone has tried to manipulate me, I've found it helpful to call it as I see it, and gently yet firmly set a boundary. "I have made my decision. Trying get me to change my mind by threatening suicide is not going to work here. If you are seriously feeling suicidal, here is the hotline number." Sometimes, I've needed to just repeat my boundary as a mantra (again, gently yet firmly): "I meant what I said. I am tired and I am not going to discuss this with you tonight"
Remember, you have the right to take care of you FIRST. This means you do not have to engage in any conversations that you don't want to. When conversations have stressed me out, I have set a boundary to limit the conversations.
Stay strong confused! You sound crystal clear about your decision and your boundaries. This too shall pass.
BlueCloud
-- Edited by BlueCloud at 01:09, 2005-12-29
canadianguy said
Dec 29, 2005
Cold as it may sound..... you have no more influence or control over his suicide, than you do over his sobriety. Statistics would likely back that the vast majority of A's who threaten suicide are doing it to play on the "pity card", and want everyone around them to feel sorry for their plight, a rather "typical" manipulation...
He's either gonna use (or fool around, or commit suicide, or whatever), or he won't..... what are YOU gonna do?
Take care of yourself, and your kids... the fear of the future is not worth giving up your today
Tom
Robinks said
Dec 29, 2005
Keep coming back, I am glad you are here.
Dolphin123 said
Dec 29, 2005
(((((((((((Confused))))))))))),
Sorry I wasn't able to log in last night. I am sorry that you are is such pain.
I agree with Kitty and Tom. What he chooses to do or not do is not in your power. It sounds like he is just trying to manipulate you into doing what he wants you to do. Telling someone that you will kill yourself if they don't........ is not a healthy way to get what they want.
Please keep talking to your pastor, if this helps you. Talk to us. Someone of us may not have been in your shoes before, I am sure some have, but speaking from someone who has not been down that road, I cannot give any ESH, but I am here, I will listen, will pray, and I will offer what ever encouragement I can.
Just a question (and I know this won't cure your pain) but what have you done for you lately? Sounds like you deserve a nice long bubble bath.
Much Love,
maresie said
Dec 29, 2005
I once had a friend commit suicide after I had spent a lot of time talking to her one night. She had been round and round and round the block with therapy, 12 step groups and more. I called her psychiatrist when I heard the news. For once I did not "blame" anyone.
I think it is terribly difficult not to feel over responsible for others especially when you care about them. What is the line between their responsibility and yours. Obviously that is a hard one. He needs of course to reach out get intensive counselling and take action on his depression. Of course he sees his depression as being generated from outside of himself I can do that too. In fact it is n't. I can over react myself to an early grave so for me setting limits boundaries, consequences are important. I have to take care of me too. I have to be in the equation too. My boyfriend is adept at making his needs "urgent" and number one priority and to hell with my needs. I can get very very tired of that but I respond differently now. I set limits, I take breaks. I no longer feel like I need to "save" him from himself.
So you can set limits, take time for yourself. Give him referrals. Have the phone number of the crisis center handy. Have more than one of them. If he calls one and they are busy he can call another. He can do that. He may not want to do that he may want you to take care of all his needs but you can't.
-- Edited by leo at 23:33, 2005-12-28
Dear Confused,
This sounds like a plea for attention or maybe not, I don't know you or your A, obviously. I do know you are supposed to take these comments seriously.
I have tried suicide twice, it is by the grace of God alone that I am still here. I would vent, I wasn't living & I was in great pain both emotionally & physically. I thought about "escaping" every other day for 20 years as I lived in a depressed & hopeless state. I didn't know how to love myself... I loved everyone but me.
I am getting better. I just wanted to say maybe you ought to talk to ppl that specialize in this, it is hard when you're dealing with an "A" you just don't know if it is manipulation or what. I never had plans but I did act out & try to OD last year. No one can stop someone or protect someone. He may very well need clinical help. When I was 15 & tried to kill myself then, I was immediately put into an institution. Most kids there stayed a year, my 4 month stay, was very short in comparison. But I wanted help & I received it.
I think getting the possesions in your name is very wise. My mother did the same thing a few months ago when all hell broke loose w/ my step-father -- got caught cheatting, admitting to a double life for 15 years, gambling, cheatting & drinking 9 hours a day, as he admitted. Dunno it might be much worse, can't trust what an addict says when they are backed into a corner, they only tell you half of the truth at best @ least this is what other addicts in recovery told me.
But she didn't want him to gamble our lives away, so the will has been reworked, everything is now in my mother's name. It is sad the lengths that they will go to to keep their secrets, that is what hides their shame & keeps the cycle of denial for them going.
It is hard to watch someone you love suffer... focus on your boys and YOURSELF. No one can be helped unless they themselves want to change. Some never do.
You can control yourself, change yourself & cure yourself. Having that is big. Other ppl will do what they will do ~ no matter what you do. Focus on you & loving yourself, hang in there.
your sis in recovery, -K
Confused,
I just read your post. It's sounds like a lot to digest! I agree with you, sounds like mind games. The suicide ideation is not good. He was divorced once before & that was when he felt suicidal & had a plan? Did he tell you what it is?
My experience is personal. I was suicidal myself, many years ago. I was in my late teens early 20's. I had a baby out of wedlock @ age 20, had very caring parents, but was very depressed. I threatened suicide. What I really wanted was help! I realize now that suicide is a selfish act. I couldn't leave my little baby behind. What would that do to him? I am 47 now & he is 27.
My life is pretty good now thanks to Alanon, it was rough for more years then not. I'm married to an active alcoholic, in denial. Came close to divorce last year. I hit bottom, felt like taking my life again. But all I really needed was a chance. I've been more faithfully working the program. That has been a blessing. I am now even grateful for marrying an alcoholic, if I didn't, i don't think I would have gotten the hepl I so desperatley needed.
I hope I was of some help.
Deb
((((((Confused))))))),
I don't have experience with this as a spouse, but as a kid, when my mother decided to leave my A father, he did much the same thing. He threatened to commit suicide or to hurt her. He brought clergy to the home to telll her divorce was wrong. He got ill. He got angry. He got nice. He pleaded. He tried to manipulate us kids. My mom told me much later, when I was grown, that a woman she went to Alanon with, told her that my father may try these types of manipulations and he did to a "T," (LOL), so my mom was ready for the manipulation. I think that this type of behavior may be par for the course with some As.
Luckily, my father never followed through with the threats. However, to maintain all of our sanities, my mother cut contact with him. Hopefully, you won't need to go to that extreme of a measure here, but you have a right to enforce boundaries to take care of YOU and the kids. When someone has tried to manipulate me, I've found it helpful to call it as I see it, and gently yet firmly set a boundary. "I have made my decision. Trying get me to change my mind by threatening suicide is not going to work here. If you are seriously feeling suicidal, here is the hotline number." Sometimes, I've needed to just repeat my boundary as a mantra (again, gently yet firmly): "I meant what I said. I am tired and I am not going to discuss this with you tonight"
Remember, you have the right to take care of you FIRST. This means you do not have to engage in any conversations that you don't want to. When conversations have stressed me out, I have set a boundary to limit the conversations.
Stay strong confused! You sound crystal clear about your decision and your boundaries. This too shall pass.
BlueCloud
-- Edited by BlueCloud at 01:09, 2005-12-29
Cold as it may sound..... you have no more influence or control over his suicide, than you do over his sobriety. Statistics would likely back that the vast majority of A's who threaten suicide are doing it to play on the "pity card", and want everyone around them to feel sorry for their plight, a rather "typical" manipulation...
He's either gonna use (or fool around, or commit suicide, or whatever), or he won't..... what are YOU gonna do?
Take care of yourself, and your kids... the fear of the future is not worth giving up your today
Tom
(((((((((((Confused))))))))))),
Sorry I wasn't able to log in last night. I am sorry that you are is such pain.
I agree with Kitty and Tom. What he chooses to do or not do is not in your power. It sounds like he is just trying to manipulate you into doing what he wants you to do. Telling someone that you will kill yourself if they don't........ is not a healthy way to get what they want.
Please keep talking to your pastor, if this helps you. Talk to us. Someone of us may not have been in your shoes before, I am sure some have, but speaking from someone who has not been down that road, I cannot give any ESH, but I am here, I will listen, will pray, and I will offer what ever encouragement I can.
Just a question (and I know this won't cure your pain) but what have you done for you lately? Sounds like you deserve a nice long bubble bath.
Much Love,
I once had a friend commit suicide after I had spent a lot of time talking to her one night. She had been round and round and round the block with therapy, 12 step groups and more. I called her psychiatrist when I heard the news. For once I did not "blame" anyone.
I think it is terribly difficult not to feel over responsible for others especially when you care about them. What is the line between their responsibility and yours. Obviously that is a hard one. He needs of course to reach out get intensive counselling and take action on his depression. Of course he sees his depression as being generated from outside of himself I can do that too. In fact it is n't. I can over react myself to an early grave so for me setting limits boundaries, consequences are important. I have to take care of me too. I have to be in the equation too. My boyfriend is adept at making his needs "urgent" and number one priority and to hell with my needs. I can get very very tired of that but I respond differently now. I set limits, I take breaks. I no longer feel like I need to "save" him from himself.
So you can set limits, take time for yourself. Give him referrals. Have the phone number of the crisis center handy. Have more than one of them. If he calls one and they are busy he can call another. He can do that. He may not want to do that he may want you to take care of all his needs but you can't.
Maresie.