Hi Everybody- Been busy making Halloween costumes and working--not reading and posting as much as I'd like. My questions for all of you for today-- How do you handle lying? I told my A that honesty was my only real boundary. If he uses, he uses--that is his choice BUT don't sneak and lie and play games. Guess what? he still did it. I know, I know---How do you know when an addict is lying? When their lips are moving. I'm just sad about it. I confronted the situation immediately (in the past I would have let it just bug me and said nothing)I just don't see what the point of boundaries is if they are not being honored. I am not sure what type of consequence needs to be in place for boundary violation. After I confronted my A with his lying--which turned out that I knew only about half of the story (as usual) He says "Well, you know, I didn't HAVE to tell you any of this" I hate that when he says that,like I should be sooooo grateful that he is telling the truth. I told him--"You OWE me the truth. It is not a gift." I just don't get why he needs to tempt fate and mess things up. Things have been going so well. But he wants to have his cake (or weed?) and eat it too. I thought we were further along on this journey. My bad. just another crabby monday- Jeanne

Jeanne, it has been my experience that if he's drinking, he's lying. Or is that lieing???? ANyway, I find that is a boundary I cannot make because it is not feasible. I just know...he's not telling me the truth. No need to try to make him, or expect that he will. Diva

Jeanne, It's a hard habit to break for the addict. They are use to lying. It's all they know. My A now that he is recovering catches himself doing that even now. Not about using alchohol because he's in a halfway house, but about little, nonconsequential things. It's how he covered up his drinking for 20 years. I don't know how you set up that boundary. But remember his brain is wired differently than ours. As for handling it, hmmmm..... can't say. When they are active, you're not talking to the same person. Hopefully your day will get better. Hang in there. Enjoy the day with the kids. Here in New England the sun is shining and it's a perfect fall day. Can't be all bad when I look outside and see God's handiwork. Live strong, Karilynn

hi gknee, A boundary is something that you put in place to protect yourself. The other side of a boundary is the consequence. When we set them, we must also be able to enforce them. Unless you are prepared to leave, lying isn't something you can control. Did your boundary include a consequence if he does? Boundaries without consequences are easily broken. Truthfully, this boundary would be veryhard for an alcoholic to keep. They have certain "alcoholic traits" and lying is usually one of them. We all hate being lied to, for me it's one of the things that reminds me to "accept the things I cannot change". It doesn't mean I accept the lying. It means to me it is part of the disease and I cannot change it. Just as he does not drink at me, he does not lie at me either. Drinking and lying are friends in his disease. Hope this helps some.. Christy

Jeanne,

I am with you on the lying but sadly, have to agree with the other postings that it is part of the disease and setting a boundary that they not lie would be, I am afraid, a premeditated resentment.  I am not sure what expectations of them we can reasonably have.

Be well,

Mike

I agree with the absolutely hate being lied to, but everyone is right--it is what they do.  They don't want to have to explain or "justify", they don't want to have to listen to what we think about it or feel about it.  They lie to "save" themself.  My a lies a lot as well--especially when he is back using/drinking.  I have found that I can get him to tell me the truth more often, when I don't get my back up about it.  I accept what he did, I don't threaten him with anything at that point--he usually feels upset about it and is scared to tell me, so I try to make it as painless as possible so he will be honest with me on more occassions.  But he does know that he will have to listen to me, normally I say "So, now what are we going to do--do you want to do something about it or are just letting me know that we are in just one of those times that you just want to do what you want to do no matter what."  Then I have to be prepared for whatever his answer is and make a decision based on that.  So far I have been lucky and he has wanted to do something about it, it's when he doesn't want to do anything about it that I'll have to make a bigger decision. 

I don't know if this is helpful, this is just what I have done.

dawn

I have learned  to just simply not ask the question. works for me. A practicing alcoholic or addict has to lie ,mostly to himself but unfortunatley lying is  a symptom of this damn disease .  If he were to look at the truth of what he was doing to the people he loved and himself he would have to do something about it  and he just isnt ready for that yet.  Denial  is a state of living the alcoholic lives in  and until He says that what he's doing is causing him a problem "It Isn't " it's causing us a problem  and  our program  will help u will that.

He is only doing what  addicted people do  drink or use. expecting anything else is definetly a set up for us . As someone said here   A premeditiated resentment  and frankly  i don't have time for those anymore .  Accepting what is , and not what we want is not easy but far more productive.   so if you can Stop expecting and start accepting your life will get easier.  good luck

Louise

thanks everybody---of course, these are not the answers I wanted to hear!! I want honesty so badly. I am so tired of being the "good one" in this relationship. Yuck. love you all--you are so right. jeanne

It's one of the things they do, I looked my A right in the eye about 5 months ago and asked him if he was using Cocaine, his pupils were HUGE!  He told me 3 times ....NOOOOOOOOO well I knew inside before he finally fessed up that he had used. 

I work in a treatment center you should hear the excuses we hear about dirty U/A's.....some are so unbelieveable that you ask yourself, "do they really think we will believe that?" 

Hang in there, remember you can only control you. 

Hugs Mary

I am sorry that you are going through this.

Sadly lies to come with the using. And the funny thing is if my "A" just fessed up and said yes when I asked, I wouldn't get that upset. It is when he lies about it that I get really angry.

I can not control his actions, and expectations are premeditated resentments. So I am working on just loving him and praying that soon my guy will come back to me. (The sober one who works a program, because that guy is wonderful)

Much Love,

-- Edited by Dolphin123 at 14:00, 2005-10-31

jeane there are deal breakers for me...........abuse/ adultery/ AND substance Abuse.......the other *abuse*   they lie,  they cheat, they  beat, sometimes,   i mean  i have been there , done that.....druggies and alkies , i dont' want in my life.......to tell you the truth??? i dont think these people even qualify for a relationship till they  have been working the program for at least two years.....than its caution, cause they can slip......a recovering coda/ or acoa is a much better bet i think...........you didn't say  are you married to him??????  if not  do you wan to be????? if not, why waste your time????? and if you ARE married....boundaries if not enforced are worthless....you gotta stand if you make a boundary..........just my take,   rosie .

Hi folks, just my 2 cents worth. It's not just the A's that lie, in my experience, they all do! I no longer expect honesty from anyone, and it used to be very important to me! Oh well, all I can do is live up to my own morals, and being honest is at the top. Sorry if I broke your bubble :(

Love in the program, TLC

It is my understanding of A's that unless they really are contrite & work the program they are telling you 25-33% at best.  It is the keystone of their disease...  they cannot be honest - they themselves don't want to know what they are doing.  And they are so self-righteous

Keep working your own program - u sd what many told me - if their lips are moving.  You may not be able to force the horse to drink but you can *rescue* yourself.