hi, just thought i would say how i see the separation of the disease and the loved one. I use the analogy that if he had a brain tumor that made his behavior not something very loveable, I would still love him. My mother was the best to me. She got a tiny bit impatient when she was so bad with the breast cancer. I knew it was not her, so did not take it personal. I accept my A as is. He is an active alcoholic. I accept his nature and symptoms as an alcoholic. He does not choose to be untrustworthy, or a liar. When it happens it is no surprise. It is the nature of the disease to cause these symptoms. LIke it was the nature of my moms bc to get into her bones. I still loved my mom, hated the damn disease. The disease controls the one we love, and until they get tired of it and get on a program, it will cont. to control them. They don't know when or if they will get so down, they will be able to stop. Some losing their license is bottom, some their job, some can lose everything, I mean everything but they still can't stop, they die. As far as trusting the A but not the disease, the A is controlled by the disease. i don't believe trust is part of the A and my relationship. i have NO expectations of him.none I might hope he will call when he says he will, or hope he will come over. But if he doesn't i don't fall apart anymore. As far as giving them money or whatever, they drink becuz they are A,not becuz you give them money. Remember the 3 C's. I give my A money for doing something around here, or just cuz i want to. If I want the money to go toward, like his trucks tags I write a check to dmv. He does not question it. When he had his last job, he got thousands of dollars. His family was all sure he would finally get his license back, pay fines, get a place to live etc. etc. I said, no he won't he will buy heroin. He was active in his addiction. Of course he would do the H. He was being controlled by the disease. IF he was in a program of recovery, been clean a while, going to his meetings, living ' his program,then I would have hoped he would have done something good for himself. But it would not be a surprise if he bought and used H. He is an alcoholic. It is the nature of the disease. I don't even know if I am getting thru with my thoughts. All I know is it works for me. I remember wishing i could stop loving him, wishing he would just die becuz he was so miserable. Wishing he would cheat so I was free to remarry someone else. But thanks to alanon i can love my husband and show him great compassion with out enabling. I see him as a pod person. the disease kidnaps him and holds him inside. the disease hates me. I don't give it any energy. not a word. well i hope i made sense. this is just me, how I do it. I feel so good inside and I love my A husband very much. I see him trying so hard to be himself in spite of the disease he hates. All i know is my vows come to mind, and I know I was blessed with this marriage. The creator knew I really loved my A so I was lead here, to learn to be able to truly love my A husband unconditionally. love,debilyn

debilyn,

 

     Oh my goodness! What you said made so much sense!!!!  I feel exactly the same way!  I understand that my husband is not the sum of his addiction and I love him very much.  I have hated his disease so much that I wished he would die or leave me for another woman or anything that would make him go away.  A few months ago I posted a letter to the addict.  I am not sure if you saw it but I am including it here.

Dear (________)

First of all, I want you to know that I do not think your addiction defines who you are as a person. You are so much more than the sum of your addiction. When I become angry and say that I don’t love you anymore, it is not you I am talking to, but your addiction.

When I fell in love with you, I fell in love with a man who I thought was kind, faithful, generous, loving, selfless, funny, and free spirited. You were so attentive and made me feel like a queen. You won my heart and the hearts of my children, though not before they tested you repeatedly. I had felt so hurt and betrayed in my past that I even put you through a few tests of my own.

Through everything, you brought out the best in me. You made me see the lighter side of things and taught me to relax. Later, I realized that it was immaturity. I also realized that when we were married, I didn’t know the real you. I only knew what you let people see. I didn’t see past the mask you put on for everyone. Maybe I didn’t want to. One morning,, I woke up and realized I fell in love with your potential, or, more accurately, the potential I saw in you. I kept pushing you to do your best, or at least, the best I thought you could do. What I did not realize was that you were doing the best you could with a horrible disease. Your best and my expectations were not one in the same.

I want to tell you that I miss you. I miss your smile and light-heartedness. I miss the fun we used to have. I miss the man I fell in love with. I miss the man who was my partner. It was us against the world. Together, we could do anything. The children miss their father and are missing out on the valuable lessons that you could teach them. I know you are lost in there somewhere. I pray that you find a way out. Sometimes I catch a glimpse of the man you once were and that is what keeps me holding on. I don’t want to give up on that man.

I love you and want you to find your way back to us.

Great minds thinking alike. I've been thinking it was time for me to post something along these lines myself. We often compare alcoholism to diabetes, when trying to make the point that it is a disease, and nagging won't make it stop. I think it's more useful to compare it with something that changes the personality of a person, like Alzheimer's, or schitzophrenia. Alcoholism is officially classed as a mental illness, and though there are physical components, I believe that a mental illness is what it is. My husband's father has dementia, and often raves and makes no sense when we are visiting him in the nursing home. A lot of what he says is truly awful, and it's difficult to listen to him for long. However, just because I don't want to listen to his raving, doesn't mean I hate him for it, or blame him. It's his disease. When my husband was being abusive in his drinking, my life was miserable. I believe I would have been justified in leaving him at that time, no one should have to take that kind of treatment. However, a combination of alanon techniques, true love, and the sheer grace of God got us through the abusive period. He stopped the abusive behaviour three years before he sobered up. During those three years, I was often unhappy. It was hard to see the man I loved sinking under his addiction. It was hard to give up my dreams of a true marriage, one where I could talk to my soul mate about anything. But you know, it wasn't really so much different than if he had MS, say, or some other disease where he gradually sank away. A man I know is dying of MS, and I imagine his loved ones are feeling very much the same way I felt during those years. He is losing his sense of self, losing his body, and his personality is changing as he accepts the reality of his death. I'm sure they're sad, I'm sure they wish it wasn't so, I'm sure that there are times when they just can't stand to be with him, as he is getting very bitter and irritable. I bet they don't hate him for it, though. We have the right to protect ourselves from our A's. Their disease can harm us, badly, if we let it. It can destroy our self esteem, it can destroy our financial stability. But, in protecting ourselves, we can still love our A's. We may not be able to live with them, but we do not have to hate and blame them. This is what is meant by "accept the things I cannot change".I think.

I've heard that our HP puts us where we need to be at any given time. After being away from these rooms for a while, mind you I was then where I needed to be as well. (I was on a path of self discovery and a re-awakening of my faith. Not to mention, working extra to pay bills). I come back to find people discussing the very thing I have a problem dealing with. Debilyn, your serenity has always had me in awe. I admire and respect your acceptance and unconditional love for your husband, drinking or not. I love my husband, and my marriage vows are binding. Our separations are of residence only, I have never considered myself free or single. I am married, I wear my rings, and more importantly I live my vows. Where my husband lives is just geography. Your post and some of the others have me thinking of the walls I put up. Wether in reality he is walking out on this family or if in fact I am the one doing it. A post of Uncle Lou's talked about hearing silence when he told his wife he loved her. It shook me up, because I have done that far too often. Out of protection or fear of enabling my husband, I'm not sure why. I whisper I love you too in my mind, but he doesn't get to hear it. Thanks for your thoughts on seperating the man from the disease. It is something I don't do very well. No matter hoew long I am in this program, I keep going back to the start. I have no control over his drinking, but more importantly, neither does he. Love Jeannie

Debilynn, You explained it so much better than I could. Thank you! Your A is very lucky have you. Live strong, Karilynn

Powerless..that is a great letter. Thank you for posting it.

i have so many thoughts on debilyn's post, and the replies.  i don't think i'm going to be able to remember them all to post them all here. 

i was planning on making my own post tonight, so i think i will share my thoughts there, but what has been written here really taps into where my thoughts are tonite, also.

there is sooo much wisdom printed here...wisdom gained from experience...and there is no greater wisdom than that!

i WILL say, tho, that the reference to alzheimers and alcoholism is so true.  my mom is nearing the end phases of alzheimers, and in reading the books on it, i believe, is when i started doing better with my a.  it is so similar.  but with alcoholism, for me anyway, it is sooo much harder to separate the disease from the person.  alcoholism, for me, just seems to make the disease SEEM like it's the person.  alzheimer's is so much easier, for me, to separate the two.  cuz the alzheimers victim doesn't go out and DO anything to further the progress of their disease.  it seems alcoholics go DO things that in my mind they just dont NEED to do!  tonite i have a dilemma with my a, tho, which is the reason i'm going to write my own post, and it makes me think i need to get back into my alzheimers books! 

i also want to say to "powerless" , that could be my letter! (except for the part of bringing out the best in me.  the worst in me came out the very first week i knew him, leading me to abandon my children to run away on a vacation with him late at night and leave my kids to wake up without even knowing i left.  i had someone there to stay with them, but..oh, it's a long story, but, sadly, he has never brought out the best in me!) i have always heard spouses say, 'they are not the person i married', and i never felt right saying that, cuz now i know he was a major a then, but like you said, he PORTRAYED himself sooo differently to me...the guy he could POTENTIALLY be.  and he tapped into my every weakness, making me think he was my knight in shining armor...saving my life!  to me, everything he portrayed himself to be when we first met was nothing but a big fat lie to make himself seem like he was everything he isnt.  your letter puts it all soo perfectly. 

i have so many thoughts going on, even before reading these posts, that i could write pages and pages!  but i am going to go write my post now, and try to cover the pertinent points that i'm needing some help on tonight.

what a 'meaty' read, here tonite!

see ya all soon!

lori