Hello everyone. I had taken a lil' hiatus from the board....needed a bit of quiet time for myself. Still working my Program strong and surrounding myself f2f w/those who work Alanon. For those who are married, how in the world to do you handle recovery and a relationship at the same time? Lil' update on my situation. Hubby has been sober for one month, which is really good. He's been to two AA meetings, which is a disappointment for me, but I remind myself HIS recovery, not mine. My A. use to have his own apartment out of town because of work and we would see each other on the weekends. Last Wednesday he got called home to work. Talk about anxiety ridden...OMG...I wasn't sure how this was going to go! Well, Thursday night we actually had a blowout. For many years I have been asking him to do things w/me-which he would only do IF it could include drinking. For the past few years I literally have lived my life as a single person. I would go here and there always alone. Our communication was/is terrible. We talk but only a superficial level, hardly ever intimate. I have been thinking a lot lately about what it is that I need and want out of a relationship-also remembering that he is in no position at this time to even give me anything emotionally. Thursday we head off to bed and he is "in the mood"..which I am totally not. He gets huffy and I apologize and tell him that I am not in the mood because I don't feel particuarly close to him lately. I am working on recognizing, accepting and expressing my feelings right now in my recovery. This goes over like a lead balloon! The simple comment of "do you ever think of what you want out of a relationship" was like tossing gas on fire. I am trying to share how I have been lonely. How my emotional needs haven't been met for so long and I am exhausted. That I want to have a companion..a marriage partner that I feel closer to than anyone else in the world. He reminds me he is going thru a process right now..that nothing is going to change overnight. I remind him that I am going thru a process now too. And that just because he has put the bottle down, that it doesn't automatically make everything all better. To which he reminds me that "maybe too much damage has already been done." He told me how he hates to see me cry so much...this was said in anger. :O( I asked.."if we can't communicate why don't we call it quits now"...to which is reply was "get your f*ckin' kids and your f*ckin' animals and get out." I will admit, I had expectations of communication, thinking that he would sit down and talk w/me. Then I became emotional when he got angry. I apologized for my delivery, but nothing that I said. I am trying NOT to take things personally, but his comment about "MY" kids really cut to the quick. I have built up this wall, to which I admitted to him and he said he knows it is there, and I realize it will take time. My problem is this total lack of feelings I have for him. He can be a great guy. We make very good room mates. But inside there is a longing that he just isn't fulfilling..a huge void that is becoming unbearable for me. He's dry, but I don't know if he is sober. I am just so tired of giving and giving emotionally and becoming drained. I decided not to give anymore of my emotions and now the lonliness is overwheming at times. I have been lonely for years, but I have always ran and busied up my time to avoid the lonliness. I never really felt it, if you know what I mean. Now I am feeling it and looking at a man that I am questioning why I am even here. I have given myself (w/the suggestion of my sponsor) 6 months before making any permanent decisions in regards to staying/leaving. Maybe I am trying to hard. I dunno. All I do know is that there is a pain inside of me thru this "process" and I am wondering how in the world do couples work thru this stuff?

Hi- I know what u r talking about. It is hard to break free of the communication patterns that we develop over the years--and when they are not using, we expect they will be our "dream mate". ha ha. He's still the same person--just without the chemical coping! Hopefully by working on themselves they develop new coping strategies. We're trying marriage therapy--but 1 hr per week isn't going to solve anything. we have to learn how to do this daily---and we have 15 years + of old communication patterns to deal with. can't solve it all in one day though, right? take it one day at a time and don't look too far ahead b good to yourself, u are worth all the effort! Jeanne

Thank you, Jeanne. You are right..I need to not look so far into the future. It is just the I have lived w/this for so long that I feel like I've had enough. I'm glad that I have allowed 6 months time to decide. It will give each one of us time to really work on ourselves. Maybe the "us" part will fall into place after taking care of the "me" part.

Sq, They often say that Lonliness is the hardest lesson of all. But once you learn how to cope with it, it becomes easier. Communication between someone who is recovering is totally different than from when they are drinking. Remember he is focusing on his recovery and you on yours. That's the way it's suppose to be. Keep in mind too that living alone and then having someone there with you will throw things off. My A is in a halfway house, and even when he comes home for a weekend, it can be awkward. Yesterday we were talking on the phone, and at one point I felt like we weren't connecting (no pun itended). It sounded like he wasn't having a great day, and I wasn't exactly at my best. Ever have one of those days when everything just breaks down? For me it was the disposal, the iron and then with him. Not a stellar day. I've learned to lower my expectations. Not to expect that he will drink again, or that we will break up. More like if we have a bad day, then it's a bad day. Then I look at it from a new perspective. Was it a REALLY BAD DAY? Or just an ordinary bad day, as couples tend to have? For me, it was the latter. That's okay. One question you might have to ask yourself is this: When the two of you were arguing was what was said out of frustration or did the two of you mean it? Or don't you really know? Which ever the answer, it's important to know the difference between them. There is no right or wrong answer. But it should provide some clarity and give you some perspective of the situation. Remember to take good care of yourself. We'll be thinking of you. Live strong, Karilynn

Hi Tammy (sorry got in a real muddle over names!)

I wish I had some easy answer to how we work through this sort of stuff cos I am in a similar place to you at the moment. My recovering A and I have just separated - temporarily, who knows?

The loss feels enormous, it is so hard not to ring, not to text, not to always have the answers and just to let go and let God. He needs space to 'sort his head' and I need to learn to live my own life and be at peace in my own skin irrespective of what choas may or may not be around me. It is so hard as you describe knowing that they are hurting, I am just trying to remind myself that I don't have his answers and I don't what the future holds and that perhaps just for today it doesn't matter. Thank goodness for my friends in Al Anon and my HP who I know is there working on me through the programme. I too have lots of kids (4) and am trying to be there for them although that too is hard because they are hurting as well. And through it all it is so lonely, especially the long nights.

The situation the other night you describe also rings home to me - I am wondering how long I have to a certain degree been going through the motions, because of the ideal I wanted rather than the reality that has been there. How often do we deny our real feelings or just not feel because it is safer, it allows the status quo to continue rather than really face things as they are, as we are having to do now?

I so hope that my partner and I will have the chance to work on these things together (all the break downs in communication and lack of intimacy that you describe and my need to 'control' and sort things) as I know that deep down there is something really good between us, but I also so know that it might be that is not meant to be and I am trying to trust that what ever happens my HP does have something wonderful in store for us both whether it be together or apart.

Hugs

Veronica

-- Edited by Veronica at 09:58, 2005-09-19

When the two of you were arguing was what was said out of frustration or did the two of you mean it? Or don't you really know? I can't speak for him, but for me I meant it. That's where I am at right now. I wish I knew if he meant it. Right now I guess I'll never know because he doesn't want to communicate. It is so difficult sometimes. He mentioned to me that the focus is on him right now, and I agreed and also added that my focus is on me right now. It does cause some conflict at times. I don't want a lot. Just some time and attention on "us". Baby steps. I realize that "cleanup" is going to take a long time..and I was hoping that if we could just be together at times enjoying life, doing lil' things here and there w/out the kids, trying to reconnect that communication and intimacy will follow. I am my own worse enemy right now. The feelings of wanting to just throw the towel in is on my mind frequently. I remind myself...Your will, not mine. What will happen will happen, in its own timeline. Today I will remind myself that I am grateful that he isn't drinking (which ironically when he was drinking would talk to me all the time..but there was a price to pay for that).

Veronica wrote:

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The situation the other night you describe also rings home to me - I am wondering how long I have to a certain degree been going through the motions, because of the ideal I wanted rather than the reality that has been there. How often do we deny our real feelings or just not feel because it is safer, it allows the status quo to continue rather than really face things as they are, as we are having to do now? I so hope that my partner and I will have the chance to work on these things together (all the break downs in communication and lack of intimacy that you describe and my need to 'control' and sort things) as I know that deep down there is something really good between us, but I also so know that it might be that is not meant to be and I am trying to trust that what ever happens my HP does have something wonderful in store for us both whether it be together or apart. Hugs Veronica

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Very true. I know that these feelings about our lack of intimacy and communication ins't anything new in our marriage. I have felt it for years. My pattern of illness is that when I would feel "needy" I would go and fill that void doing things w/other people. I would just simply "replace" him in a sense. I would mention how I was feeling to him, but he wouldn't ever address it with me. So off I would go w/friends and enjoy life w/out him but still having this underlying saddness inside that he wasn't w/me. Over the years it has become totally imbalanced. We are two people living in the same house, living seperate lives. Room mates. I also am of the thinking that this may or may not be something that we will be able to work thru. Being that I am confused in my head right now is tellng me that no decisions are to be made at the moment.

I don't know if this makes sense...but even couples who don't have addiction attached to there menu of crap have days/nights like you had. And men/women who aren't A's respond to rejection with harse words too.

 

Take it a day at a time. You may be right...he may be not drinking but not sober. But at least he's not drinking! Prayer helps.

Sq, It's true you can't make him communicate. The same way you can't make him stop drinking. The choices we all make are ours and ours alone. My point is that you have to keep the focus on your recovery and as he does on him. That's going to cause conflict at times. It does with me and my A. It's is frustrating to see that it's all about them. There are times when I want to scream and say stop being so selfish! But recovery for all is a selfish thing. For both. We are our own worse enemies! That's being human. It's good that we can recognize it. Some people can't. That's the beauty of finding a place like this. We can rant , rave and recover . You're doing just fine. Live strong, Karilynn

 

You sound like you are telling my story and I feel the same way a lot of the time.  I feel like a roommate and am very lonley too.  I am not here out of being in love or from being fulfilled by any means.  And it is a constant source of aggravation.  All I can do is be grateful for the good things I have FOR NOW because I am hopeful for the future.  I know that things will eventually be better.  How do I know this?  I just feel it.  I will attain my goals when I can.  Until then, I do the best I can by not arguing and focusing on my recovery and my kids.  I do the things that make me happy and try to not think about what he is doing or saying.  He has no clue so why bother?  I hope things work out for you

Love Julie

Hi,

I know that feeling of lonliness....it is a horrible feeling, to live single as a married person.  I too am trying not to make rash decisions....to wait things out, it is hard....hang in there.  Keep concentrating on you, focus on your happiness. 

Hugs Mary

I agree wholeheartedly with Kicky. In my 1st marriage I was lonely for at least 20 years! There was total lack of communication, he went his way, I went mine. I stuck to it 'for the kids' but wonder if I should have? They thought my marriage was normal and grew up repeating my mistakes in some ways. By the way, my ex wasn't a drinker, but was a ACOA.

I think all marriages get 'stale' after awhile. We get busy raising children and sort of put each other on the back burner. Then the kids grow up, move away, or start school and we get lonely for the man/woman we used to know.

Time changes us all and we take each other for granted. We want what we once had back again, still love each other, but...  Some of us go on to new relationships, and a few years down the road, go through the same thing all over again. I guess we'll never feel the idealism we once felt at the beggining, after living with a person for a while, we learn that they aren't perfect, but hey, neither are we!

I know Alcoholism really takes a toll on a relationship, and certain things we may be able to forgive, just can't be forgotten. Every once in a while, well... maybe more than that, I get so filled with resentment and wonder why I put up with it all, but I am happier with my A than I was with my ex. Don't know if this will help anyone, but it's what I have experienced, take what you want, and leave the rest. Love, TLC

When I had one month without a drink, I didn't consider myself sober. I understood that this is a process that takes time and requires continued progress. I'm sober 2 years and still feel like I still have my head up my ass sometimes. If you can, both of you (I realize that you can't do it for him) might want to remove all expectations of each other right now and just work on yourselves. Expectations, especially at this point will lead to nothing but resentments, which you both need to avoid like the plague right now. If anything keep a gratitude list and read it and add to it daily. It may help you put things in their proper perspective.

Lou

Hi,

  I can really relate to your feelings and it is hard to feel so lonely with someone right next to you.  The thing that stood out to me as I read your post is that you are feeling the void and emptyness in your heart.  It sounds like you think if your relationship was what you hoped for with your husband you wouldn't feel that.  I understand that believe me, I often feel and think that way.  But something that I am in the very slow process of learning, that lonely, empty feeling cannot be filled up by another person even if the A magically turned into prince charming over night.  We all know this in our heads, but in real life it is hard to put into practice.  Filling the empty void inside you is between you and God. 

 I know this for I speak, as my husband is an A as well and know all too well those lonely nights.  I also have four kids who take an awful lot on a daily (hourly :) basis.  Then having an A for a husband who at times does a lot more taking than giving and you feel constantly drained and the one person who is supposed to help fill you back up isn't, it is easy to look at that and blame and be angry, and definatley put that wall of protection up, trying to stop the hurt. 

I am learning this, as I am in the same boat as you, so just typing this is reminding me, and reinforcing it in my life.  I am going to have to learn how to fill my own cup and take care of myself in a way between God and I that I am ok, and don't need it from the other person.  It is insanity to expect or want it from someone who has no track record of giving it or even having a clue what it is you want from him.  I have been taking babysteps lately on what I need to do for myself so that I can continue to be there for my kids as well as for my husband. 

Noone can tell you what it is that you need to do for yourself.  Each person, family and situation is different.  For me in my situation right now it has been as simple (first babystep) as picking a night and scheduleing it on the calander each week to get some time to pamper myself, figure out what I like (doesn't have to be expensive) and do it.  Sometimes it is as simple as sitting with a good novel.  (not a sappy romance!! haha)  I am seeing that I need to start doing for myself some of those things I have been waiting for him to do.  I am going to buy myself flowers every once in a while for no reason.  Just because they make me happy.  I am going to do things to encourage myself in the way that I need encouragment and they way I wish my husband would. 

Most importantly of all, I need to schedule time in my day to sit quietly and let God's loving and caring voice speak to that needy, empty spot in my heart.  Let Him heal the hurts of the day, fill the expectations.  Then I will be a whole person who has what it takes to give to my family and not need anything in return.  Yes, relationships are a two way street and the relationship will never be what it could be as long as it is one way.  But there is something positive you get from your husband or you would've never married him or wouldn't have stayed.  Look for that, believe me there are times when I have had to look very very hard!! 

Lastly, I am willing to bet the farm that your husband did not mean what he said about your leaving.  That sounded like a hurt reaction to me.  You suggested the possiblity of ending things.  I know that you were trying to shock him into the reality that you have needs that are being ignored, and that you are feeling hopeless.  But he is too selfish to see that right now.  So instead it hurt him that you suggested it because he can only see himself and his feelings and needs right now.  So he reacted by trying to make it sound as if he didn't care, go ahead and leave.  That was his defense against hurting and being volnerable.  He is so screwed up right now, he can't even acknowledge that you have human needs and it scares him to death to think that you do and he may need to do something about that because he doesn't have the slightest idea what to do or how to do it or how to get over his fear of intimacy.  He is angry because something is being asked of him and he doesn't have the "tools" to deal with it.  He is angry because it is not all about him all the time.  But he doesn't really want you to leave, in fact he was angry that you weren't in the mood because he needs you so much right now.  We just see it as sex and think for them as it so often is about meeting a physical need.  But he is volnerable right now trying to stop drinking, and he hates it.   It probably scared him that you weren't wanting to be with him as it is normal for unhealthy people to mask fear with anger.  Physical intimacy is probably all that he is capable of.   

It's a long road for us to deal with our own fears and hurts and then try to also deal with the other persons as well as they can't manage their own and put them on us!!  But you can do it.  With God's help and guidance. 

Take care of yourself,

Kris

Wow! Thank you everyone for such good replies. Definately food for thought. Thank you, Uncle Bruce, for your insight from the other side of the coin. I really appreciate it. I think that I took back what I gave over to my HP. Sometimes I feel like I am going full steam ahead in the Program that I almost run over my A. I am going to a f2f meeting tonight at 8...there is an AA meeting down the hall. I invited my husband to go w/absolutely no expectations and no guilt trip. Just told him of the meeting and invited him to ride w/if he wants. Babysteps.