One of the things I enjoy at my job is the old timers I work with. Some of our drivers are older retired men from everything from the military to Wall Street. They all now drive a school bus as a way of making extra cash and keeping themselves busy. They also love to talk and tell stories, and I usually enjoy listening. Today I really listened.
This morning I was sitting with one of the guys on a trip and he asked me if I was okay, he said the spring seemed out of my step and I looked tired. I told him I was having trouble at home, he questioned me a little and hte whole story came pouring out.
What I didn't know but found out this morning is that he is a recovering alcoholic, "with 20 years off the bottle" as he put it.
I found myself defending myself to him, telling him that I am not the witch, the Saint or the crazy person my husband accuses me of being. That I am not this bitchy control freak who has to manage everything. I am not this drudge he makes me out to be. I told him about the counciling the whole mess.
I could have fallen over with his answer. He told me I forgot something I was, and I said what and he said " your a liar." I just stared at him and he said don't blow little one, I'm just telling you the truth.
He said of couse you are those things your husband says you are. He said your married to a drunk. There is nothing else you could be.
I said great now I have people at work picking on me. He told me he was just being honest. He said like most other wives of drunks (his word, not mine) he said I have taken on the responsibility of the family, of keeping everyone safe, of keeping a roof over our heads and food in our bellies. He said someplace inside my husband buried under the denial he knows it, but can't admitt it.
He said you might be all of those things, but his drinking is what made you that way, and yes you let it happen.
He told me that my husband is obviously not in recovery, and I said no. I told him that I am going to Alanon, but he continues to drink. I said he wants me to go to marriage counciling with him, to fix all of the things that I do wrong. He laughed and said he can't fix anything until he puts down the booze. He said a man in recovery will accept that although both parties are sick and need to change, that he has to do it first. That he cannot expect trust or unconditional love form a woman he has belittled and abused for years. That promises mean nothing until they are proven to be real.
He said he hears many men whine about how they are no longer drinking and yet their wives still won't trust them or give their all to a relationship. Let them handle the finances and make the decisions. He says he always feels that these men have a lot of work to do, because even if they are not drinking, they still want everything to their way, they are still self serving and centered. That it takes time for the wife to do this, to believe that this time it is real and the whole mess won't end up dumped in her lap.
He told me that in reality the relationship was destroyed by the drunk, and the drunk will have to make seriouse efforts to repair it, and feel fortunate that he even has that chance.
He said while yes we need to trust our higher power, lets be practical. Wives of drunks have another problem. Bills need to be paid, kids need food, kids need shoes. He said it is tough to be faithful when your morgage payment is in the bottle of a bottle or lost on a pool game. He said it is a wonderful thought to leave it to chance, to just let things happen, but if the drunk goes down, the family does too, and most woman can't let that happen.
He told me wives of drunks are a special breed. He said yep they can be bitchy, he told me his Wife was queen of that when he was drinking, but he said if it wasn't for her perserverence, he wouldn't have had anything left when he did finally quit, and he said he has spent 20 years thanking her for it.
He told me to stop defending myself. He said no amount of defending will do any good to my husband. He said he knows what you are, he doesn't want to admitt it, or have you know it.
He told me to keep working on me, and to go to the counciling with my husband, but don't defend myself, he told me accept responsibilities for my actions and attitudes, but just tell my husband that I am what I am because of his drinking. He said if and when he did accept recovery he will see that, and if he is true will try and make amends. He said if he became sober he would realize that if I was sweet and accomodating to his wishes while drinking, I would be homeless and he would probably be dead.
He said the next time he tells me that I should be the perfect wife, tell him that Robert Young in Father knows best wasn't a drunk, and to deal with it.
He then told me I had spunk and not to ever let anyone take that away from me. He said my husband is a lucky man, and hopefully some day he will realize it, but I will know if I let myself, when to say Uncle.
I left work feeling really good. A lot more accepting of myself than I have been lately. Nothing has changed, but maybe hearing about recovery from soemone on the other side has helped me to understand a little more. I do realize that no matter how much work I have done, I am still in protect mode. I am still holding on to so much garbage, maybe that is why the stress is so heavy right now. I thought I was accepting myself, but I was trying to supress or force myself instead, and I have been on the defense a lot.
So far today is a good day, and it is even sunny outside.
Sorry this was so long but I wanted to share it with you all.
Love jeannie
-- Edited by Jeannie at 11:26, 2005-04-05
cdb said
Apr 5, 2005
Hello Jeannie,
Thanks so much for sharing this with me. My first thought was, wow, HP/God is guiding your life right now. The conversation you had seems to be of excellent timing,,don't you think? :) I have found with my daughter and some other AA people I have talked to that they are quite direct and to the point. I almost feel envious that I am not the same way. He made it all seem so simple, didn't he?
It is always great to have people where we work at support and listen to us when it is needed. I have found too that some AAs don't even tell you they are an alcoholic until situations like yours. When my daughter left her job and didn't return recently, her boss put a note on her envelope of her last paycheck that was mailed to our house. He said, HI to her, a smiley face and hope you are doing good. Well, he should have been angry for leaving him without notice etc. I had met him too in the small town she lived in. My thought was that somehow he understood about her alcoholism because her boyfriend most likely told him that is what happened to her. He seemd to be reaching out to her but she in her disease didn't get it. I even wonder if he was an alcoholic too. She never did go talk to him in person like he wanted to. Life is interesting. This just shows me that our HP/God may truly be in control when we allow him/her to be.
Whatever the reason, it must sure help to have a new perspective to base your decisions and thoughts on. It sure opened my eyes to different thinking too. Thanks again for posting this. your friend, cdb :)
jj said
Apr 5, 2005
(((((Jeannie))))) Thank you so much for the share!!! I like Cdb saw you HP sending this man to you. MAd me remember a great friend of mine who happened to be a member of AA who caught me defending myself against my AH. He would always say to me "Whats your problem because I surly don't have one" I would always reply to him I don't have one you do, your a drunk". This friend in the kindest way possible at the time put me in my place and let me know simmilar things like I was the one with the problem being his drinking and how I felt it affected me and so on. That in my insanity he saw an insane person where as I felt I was in the middle of this mind blowing battle ground where I constantly defended myself or was imbarrased because of my AH's behavior. So even though I thought I was sane being sober and clear to me I was indeed the insane one.
I was doing some work on me the other day and I noticed something in me, I always find it much easier to be helpful to others and see things in a much different way then they would notice and when explained by another person it seems much clearer but to see these things in myself or my situation it is so hard. Taking that step back and looking in as thou a stranger would helps clarify the situation.
Love and hugs, Glad you are having a better day.
Your friend JJ
bcanuck said
Apr 5, 2005
Hi Jeannie
Wow, did this guy show up at an opportune time or what. It's interesting to see the perspective from the other side when we're in the middle of all this stuff.
Hi,
One of the things I enjoy at my job is the old timers I work with. Some of our drivers are older retired men from everything from the military to Wall Street. They all now drive a school bus as a way of making extra cash and keeping themselves busy. They also love to talk and tell stories, and I usually enjoy listening. Today I really listened.
This morning I was sitting with one of the guys on a trip and he asked me if I was okay, he said the spring seemed out of my step and I looked tired. I told him I was having trouble at home, he questioned me a little and hte whole story came pouring out.
What I didn't know but found out this morning is that he is a recovering alcoholic, "with 20 years off the bottle" as he put it.
I found myself defending myself to him, telling him that I am not the witch, the Saint or the crazy person my husband accuses me of being. That I am not this bitchy control freak who has to manage everything. I am not this drudge he makes me out to be. I told him about the counciling the whole mess.
I could have fallen over with his answer. He told me I forgot something I was, and I said what and he said " your a liar." I just stared at him and he said don't blow little one, I'm just telling you the truth.
He said of couse you are those things your husband says you are. He said your married to a drunk. There is nothing else you could be.
I said great now I have people at work picking on me. He told me he was just being honest. He said like most other wives of drunks (his word, not mine) he said I have taken on the responsibility of the family, of keeping everyone safe, of keeping a roof over our heads and food in our bellies. He said someplace inside my husband buried under the denial he knows it, but can't admitt it.
He said you might be all of those things, but his drinking is what made you that way, and yes you let it happen.
He told me that my husband is obviously not in recovery, and I said no. I told him that I am going to Alanon, but he continues to drink. I said he wants me to go to marriage counciling with him, to fix all of the things that I do wrong. He laughed and said he can't fix anything until he puts down the booze. He said a man in recovery will accept that although both parties are sick and need to change, that he has to do it first. That he cannot expect trust or unconditional love form a woman he has belittled and abused for years. That promises mean nothing until they are proven to be real.
He said he hears many men whine about how they are no longer drinking and yet their wives still won't trust them or give their all to a relationship. Let them handle the finances and make the decisions. He says he always feels that these men have a lot of work to do, because even if they are not drinking, they still want everything to their way, they are still self serving and centered. That it takes time for the wife to do this, to believe that this time it is real and the whole mess won't end up dumped in her lap.
He told me that in reality the relationship was destroyed by the drunk, and the drunk will have to make seriouse efforts to repair it, and feel fortunate that he even has that chance.
He said while yes we need to trust our higher power, lets be practical. Wives of drunks have another problem. Bills need to be paid, kids need food, kids need shoes. He said it is tough to be faithful when your morgage payment is in the bottle of a bottle or lost on a pool game. He said it is a wonderful thought to leave it to chance, to just let things happen, but if the drunk goes down, the family does too, and most woman can't let that happen.
He told me wives of drunks are a special breed. He said yep they can be bitchy, he told me his Wife was queen of that when he was drinking, but he said if it wasn't for her perserverence, he wouldn't have had anything left when he did finally quit, and he said he has spent 20 years thanking her for it.
He told me to stop defending myself. He said no amount of defending will do any good to my husband. He said he knows what you are, he doesn't want to admitt it, or have you know it.
He told me to keep working on me, and to go to the counciling with my husband, but don't defend myself, he told me accept responsibilities for my actions and attitudes, but just tell my husband that I am what I am because of his drinking. He said if and when he did accept recovery he will see that, and if he is true will try and make amends. He said if he became sober he would realize that if I was sweet and accomodating to his wishes while drinking, I would be homeless and he would probably be dead.
He said the next time he tells me that I should be the perfect wife, tell him that Robert Young in Father knows best wasn't a drunk, and to deal with it.
He then told me I had spunk and not to ever let anyone take that away from me. He said my husband is a lucky man, and hopefully some day he will realize it, but I will know if I let myself, when to say Uncle.
I left work feeling really good. A lot more accepting of myself than I have been lately. Nothing has changed, but maybe hearing about recovery from soemone on the other side has helped me to understand a little more. I do realize that no matter how much work I have done, I am still in protect mode. I am still holding on to so much garbage, maybe that is why the stress is so heavy right now. I thought I was accepting myself, but I was trying to supress or force myself instead, and I have been on the defense a lot.
So far today is a good day, and it is even sunny outside.
Sorry this was so long but I wanted to share it with you all.
Love jeannie
-- Edited by Jeannie at 11:26, 2005-04-05
Hello Jeannie,
Thanks so much for sharing this with me. My first thought was, wow, HP/God is guiding your life right now. The conversation you had seems to be of excellent timing,,don't you think? :) I have found with my daughter and some other AA people I have talked to that they are quite direct and to the point. I almost feel envious that I am not the same way. He made it all seem so simple, didn't he?
It is always great to have people where we work at support and listen to us when it is needed. I have found too that some AAs don't even tell you they are an alcoholic until situations like yours. When my daughter left her job and didn't return recently, her boss put a note on her envelope of her last paycheck that was mailed to our house. He said, HI to her, a smiley face and hope you are doing good. Well, he should have been angry for leaving him without notice etc. I had met him too in the small town she lived in. My thought was that somehow he understood about her alcoholism because her boyfriend most likely told him that is what happened to her. He seemd to be reaching out to her but she in her disease didn't get it. I even wonder if he was an alcoholic too. She never did go talk to him in person like he wanted to. Life is interesting. This just shows me that our HP/God may truly be in control when we allow him/her to be.
Whatever the reason, it must sure help to have a new perspective to base your decisions and thoughts on. It sure opened my eyes to different thinking too. Thanks again for posting this. your friend, cdb :)
(((((Jeannie))))) Thank you so much for the share!!! I like Cdb saw you HP sending this man to you. MAd me remember a great friend of mine who happened to be a member of AA who caught me defending myself against my AH. He would always say to me "Whats your problem because I surly don't have one" I would always reply to him I don't have one you do, your a drunk". This friend in the kindest way possible at the time put me in my place and let me know simmilar things like I was the one with the problem being his drinking and how I felt it affected me and so on. That in my insanity he saw an insane person where as I felt I was in the middle of this mind blowing battle ground where I constantly defended myself or was imbarrased because of my AH's behavior. So even though I thought I was sane being sober and clear to me I was indeed the insane one.
I was doing some work on me the other day and I noticed something in me, I always find it much easier to be helpful to others and see things in a much different way then they would notice and when explained by another person it seems much clearer but to see these things in myself or my situation it is so hard. Taking that step back and looking in as thou a stranger would helps clarify the situation.
Love and hugs, Glad you are having a better day.
Your friend JJ
Hi Jeannie
Wow, did this guy show up at an opportune time or what. It's interesting to see the perspective from the other side when we're in the middle of all this stuff.
Hugs and best wishes,
Bonnie